Luminous Landscape Forum
Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: stevesanacore on November 02, 2009, 08:22:03 am
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I am meeting a lot of photographers that use the Hasselblad H3d systems and are very happy with them but on this forum all I seem to see is Phase One users. Hasselblad has some very attractive packages on the H3D 39 and the new H4D 60 and I was wondering what are peoples experiences with them compared with Phase One? My biggest issue with Phase is the Mamiya system which I used to use in the film days and hated it. If I invest in MF then I need a totally integrated system for most work.
So what's the scoop on Hasselblad? Thanks.
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I am meeting a lot of photographers that use the Hasselblad H3d systems and are very happy with them but on this forum all I seem to see is Phase One users. Hasselblad has some very attractive packages on the H3D 39 and the new H4D 60 and I was wondering what are peoples experiences with them compared with Phase One? My biggest issue with Phase is the Mamiya system which I used to use in the film days and hated it. If I invest in MF then I need a totally integrated system for most work.
So what's the scoop on Hasselblad? Thanks.
Try both of the systems out if you have the opportunity. I ended up with H3d, I even tried Leica S2 not to long ago. In a long term I figured that Hasselblad is a stayer in the marked as well.
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Well, what do you need a mfdb for? If you need it for copy work perhaps multishot capability is very important and you have to chose hasselblad or sinar. If you are a long exposure photographer well, you need phaseone. If you needed 60 megapixels 3 months ago, you needed phaseone. These are just exemples. What do you mislike about mamiya? What do you need in a camera? Perhaps all the users in this forum are happy with phaseone, i'm one of the happy part. A friend of mine has the hasselblad system. The new small sensor format lenses are superb, fast, sharp and very clean. He has the multishot model. He can't use it because phocus crashes his computer... We tried 3 differents macs and all the times CRASH. Now, perhaps flexcolor is better, we didn't try it. But he's keep trying and looking for solutions. I'm shooting, and without problems. He has the 28mm and the 35-90mm. He needs the 210mm but he just bought a new macbook thet doesn't work properly with phocus. I bought used on ebay a 210 and a 50 shift, for less then 1000 euro. They simply work great. For my experience, phaseone is a very good product and very simple to use, that's why i'm happy with it. I also bought it as an ex-demo, so it was "cheap".
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If I invest in MF then I need a totally integrated system for most work.
Hasselblad makes a good product which, like any other product, has both positives and negatives. Phase One makes a strong product as well which also has positives and negatives. I think you'd be doing yourself a disservice if you don't spend at least a few hours with each system actually in your hands, taking pictures, and taking those pictures all the way through your workflow.
Why do you think you need a totally integrated system? There are some real advantageous and some marketing-only advantageous as well as some significant disadvantages.
I'd encourage you to get your hands on the newer Mamiya/Phase body and lens options since they are generations ahead of the Mamiya bodies/lenses you would have tried back in the days of yore.
I'd also point out that you can use a Phase back on an H2 body. In fact this combination is still the most popular in the Florida rental market (since up until now Phase has not had a leaf-shutter lens option and high-speed flash sync is a requirement in the sunny Florida outdoor photography market).
Full disclosure - see my signature - I work for a dealer that works with Phase One (along with Canon, Leaf, Leica, Eizo etc). But I think it's perfectly fair of me to encourage you to do your OWN hands on testing and not rely too much on what you read marketing wise about "integration" etc.
Doug Peterson ()
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I'm sure I will try them both before I commit. Would love to know the up and down sides to each system. Workflow, live view, tethering etc.
I shoot only on location and need to usually work fast. A tech camera would be an option for very little percentage of work. Fast and simple setup is my main priority.
Thanks for any input as I have not decided MF is for me yet. Still investigating if I can make it work for me.
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According to this poll, 42% of this forum uses Phase One: http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=20962 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20962)
Actually, all the brands are quite well represented but the Phase guys make most noise comparing the 1% improvement of the AFD XIV body over the AFD XIII as Phase brings out a new camera body every two weeks
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From a distance, it appears that Hasselblad is owned more by people shooting landscapes or the like. Maybe, in that low pressure scenario, HocusPhocus would be just fine. But it always seems that, when there's money on the table, you see people using Phase and 3.79, or Leaf backs. I think people are forcibly being dragged into using 4.83 to tether, due to Phase locking out 3.79 on the newer backs, and I guess, someday, 4.83 will be regarded as stable as 3.79. But trust me, when the light is fading, and the AD has that concerned look on his face, the very last words you want to hear are: "Uh, we need to restart CaptureOne; it just crashed". DPP/EOS Utility, you never hear those words, and very rarely with CaptureOne 3.79 either.
But I will give you that: you rarely hear of anyone using a Hasselblad back. In person, or in YouTube videos, or the like. It's strange. You see the bodies everywhere, but always with Leaf or Phase backs on them. I spoke with a NYC beauty retoucher at a party recently, and he said most of his files are from Leaf backs, then Phase second, then Canon third. He didn't even mention Hasselblad.
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I have to disagree, AFDIII is at least 7.8% better than mine AFDII
Indeed, number of Mamiya 645AFD cameras may be mind-boggling... DM56, DM33, DM28, DM22, AFD I, II, III, 645DF.. what the hell..
As for the nomenclature, they should keep it at AFD I/II/III and 645DF as it introduces significant improvements.
According to this poll, 42% of this forum uses Phase One: http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index....showtopic=20962 (http://luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=20962)
Actually, all the brands are quite well represented but the Phase guys make most noise comparing the 1% improvement of the AFD XIV body over the AFD XIII as Phase brings out a new camera body every two weeks
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From a distance, it appears that Hasselblad is owned more by people shooting landscapes or the like. Maybe, in that low pressure scenario, HocusPhocus would be just fine. But it always seems that, when there's money on the table, you see people using Phase and 3.79, or Leaf backs. I think people are forcibly being dragged into using 4.83 to tether, due to Phase locking out 3.79 on the newer backs, and I guess, someday, 4.83 will be regarded as stable as 3.79. But trust me, when the light is fading, and the AD has that concerned look on his face, the very last words you want to hear are: "Uh, we need to restart CaptureOne; it just crashed". DPP/EOS Utility, you never hear those words, and very rarely with CaptureOne 3.79 either.
But I will give you that: you rarely hear of anyone using a Hasselblad back. In person, or in YouTube videos, or the like. It's strange. You see the bodies everywhere, but always with Leaf or Phase backs on them. I spoke with a NYC beauty retoucher at a party recently, and he said most of his files are from Leaf backs, then Phase second, then Canon third. He didn't even mention Hasselblad.
I agree and would recommend to have a serious look at the combination of H Camera with Leaf DB. We are shooting beauty and fashion, doing our own post processing and love the files we get from Leaf Capture. We also prefer the colors of the Dalsa chip over the Kodak Colors (funny enough that Leaf belonged to Kodak, but never used the Kodak sensors). For me lot of "Integration" of the Hasselblad H Series seems to correct their own faults of lenses and backs.
Cheers
Ulf
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From a distance, it appears that Hasselblad is owned more by people shooting landscapes or the like. Maybe, in that low pressure scenario, HocusPhocus would be just fine. But it always seems that, when there's money on the table, you see people using Phase and 3.79, or Leaf backs. I think people are forcibly being dragged into using 4.83 to tether, due to Phase locking out 3.79 on the newer backs, and I guess, someday, 4.83 will be regarded as stable as 3.79. But trust me, when the light is fading, and the AD has that concerned look on his face, the very last words you want to hear are: "Uh, we need to restart CaptureOne; it just crashed". DPP/EOS Utility, you never hear those words, and very rarely with CaptureOne 3.79 either.
But I will give you that: you rarely hear of anyone using a Hasselblad back. In person, or in YouTube videos, or the like. It's strange. You see the bodies everywhere, but always with Leaf or Phase backs on them. I spoke with a NYC beauty retoucher at a party recently, and he said most of his files are from Leaf backs, then Phase second, then Canon third. He didn't even mention Hasselblad.
Well yes, it's interesting that so few people on here use Hasselblad backs. But there must be quite a few out there and would love to hear from users. Wish I could have gone to Photo+ last month and talk to the reps directly from all these companies.
The one thing I could never tolerate is software crashing during a shoot. Even though most clients understand software issues, it's a very unpleasant event for me to say the least. I would hope to also avoid Capture One or Phocus etc. All I need is a simple capture utility that will send the photo to Lightroom as I do with my Canons now.
I actually started my digital career with Leaf using their 4x5" scanner. They were in a league by themselves when it came to their scanning software and hardware. But these days, it's hard to buy into a system that looks like a stepchild to Phase One's own P+ backs.
Not looking to start a war between backs, just looking to get objective info on which is the best for me. Don't need long exposure more than 30 seconds, flash sync above 250th, or more than 1 frame a second. Thanks!
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But these days, it's hard to buy into a system that looks like a stepchild to Phase One's own P+ backs.
Only the owners of pre-Leaf Imaging backs are treated as stepchildren, but (we, in our rooms under the stairs, hope) those policies may be easing.
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Always nice to see the guys from Capture Integration helping out in a Hasselblad Thread
These forums tend to be very Phase biased so you might be forgiven for thinking that Hasselblad does not sell any cameras.. I could point you at a forum where it appears that Sinar completely dominates the market if you like
FYI I have been shooting with the latest beta of Phocus 2 for the last week and have yet to see a crash.
Oh and get someone to show you lens corrections on the 28mm Phase's corrections are shall we say, "different".
Nick-T
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Only the owners of pre-Leaf Imaging backs are treated as stepchildren, but (we, in our rooms under the stairs, hope) those policies may be easing.
I have been using the Hasselblad H3d-50 for over a month now. Moved into it after leaving the Leica DMR. I love it. And I shoot mostly fashion with some landscapes. Fashion work is typically done in a studio but not always. The files from the Hasselblad, even with my limited experience working with it, are fantastic. I can print large 40" x 60" store displays that essentially blow the Leica DMR away. And I am not just talking pixels here. I am talking skin tones and color fidelity. It is harder to use than the Leica but having the use of the autofocus, which I never wanted for fashion, has turned out to be a big plus. I have coded the camera to operate on manual focus unless I push the "user" button and then it will quickly autofocus. Just my way of double checking.
I could not be happier and I, for one, like the proprietary Phocus program. It makes total short term and long term sense to me that the people best equipped to design software for Hasselblad is Hasselblad. Time will tell but, to date, I have no issues what-so-ever and am in total love with the files it produces.
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(snip) We tried 3 differents macs and all the times CRASH. Now, perhaps flexcolor is better, we didn't try it. But he's keep trying and looking for solutions. I'm shooting, and without problems. He has the 28mm and the 35-90mm. He needs the 210mm but he just bought a new macbook thet doesn't work properly with phocus (snip)
Phocus uses OpenGL commands extensively for speed of display, so it is important to have a strong graphics card with 512MB VRAM. Please pass our info over to your friend, happy to see if we can help him/her out.
-John
hotwire-digital.com
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I have an H3DII-31 and I am very happy with it.
I don't shoot tethered. I have had some stability issues with earlier versions of Phocus but the most recent updates seem OK, and I look forward to version 2. (Nick T - any idea on release date for version 2? Any sneaky hints as to new features, or is it all under NDA?)
As someone moving up from 35mm dSLRs, the systems integration was if anything a bit of a plus for me. Everything runs from the same battery, for example, which makes it easier to pack for a day in the field.
The bottom line is that the images from the Hasselblad have really re-ignited my enthusiasm for photography which is a good thing when it is the way I make my living. The camera is a joy to use and although it has flaws (most particularly the LCD display, which is really only useful for looking at the histogram!) it also has some very strong plus points which mattered to me (like base ISO 100 because of the microlenses, which as I hand hold a lot is important).
But as others have said, try every system you think might suit you before you buy. Pro Centre in London let me hire a camera for the day and offered to refund the hire fee if I purchased a system, which was nice of them. I'd certainly want to try the Leica and Mamiya/Phase options if I were buying now.
Cheers, Hywel
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horses for courses - I use H3D22 for over 2 years now, 90% tethered and never have issues with software. I used flex, now onto phocus, I find it very reliable. I use on H3 body and Sinar P2. I would love if they could shoot tethered into lightroom, but for the meantime this works.
if you want an easy, bulletproof system thats very affordable go the 5D2 route...
one other thing - I see tons of files on the post side of my business from working pros in the field on location and A LOT of those files are hassie. Some phase , very few leaf...
IMHO everyone sees what they want...
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After looking at all the options I recently moved from 35mm digital to a Hasselblad H3DII-22 and don't regret the decision a bit. The camera is easy to use and the software was also no problem (not one crash). It does have its limitations and I have decided to keep my Canon system for events and low light, while formal portraits and studio work are now done exclusively with the Hasselblad. No knock on Phase, the reps I dealt with were great and the files produced were excellent, just felt Hasselblad had the edge.
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I use Hasselblad for about 3 years now and am very happy with it. There is always room for improvement. I use H2F with CF39 & CF39MS. For multishot I would still recommend Flexcolor over Phocus though that might change with 2.0.
I shoot mainly catalogue, stills & some portraits. Everything that doesn't move, given time I will try to multishot.
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I agree with Doug Peterson's post about getting your hands on the systems so you can evaluate how they feel, what is the workflow like, can it work in a manner important to you, and real-world applications practical to you as a photographic user in this case...
There are a lot of marketing campaigns, competitive dis-information, out-of-date pubs and by getting a hands-on you can do a proper evaluation sans the "noise"
I disagree with Doug's suggestion that a photographer must choose between integrated and modular systems, given that the H3D digital magazine can be used on a large format camera or any other system that can accept a Hasselblad H-mount.*
But that is why some readers come here to get a start on or continue their research, right?
-John
hotwire-digital.com
* Williams, John. "Baby's got Back" published 14-October-2009, Hands-on Reviews - Cameras, hotwire-digital.com Accessed 2-November-2009.
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seems hassy customers are pretty happy with their system
and that's why they are kind of silent on this page.
just a good camera and nothing to complain about?
or is there also some connection to the
reliability of the announcements made by the company?
i'm sure the competitors sooner or later
will change their nasty attitude
and i also will keep my mouth shut...
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Hi All,
Great Plug there there Dougie Boy for the Blad H2-the fact you mention it will take the Phase Backs--easily the best combo for the Phase Ones.
Any alternative to that POS Mamiya 645 body is welcome in our long suffering Industry.
Incidentally I have been a Blad owner since 1963 and luv em to bits--had the Imacon/V/H1 Combos with superb results-so no gripes there.
DesW
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I asked this question on another thread, but no Hasselblad owners responded. Is there a Hasselblad back/camera that closely meets these criteria:
1. Roughly a frame a second, or quicker.
2. Roughly 22MP.
3. Large clear clean previews on 3" LCD.
4. Usable clean ASA of 400.
5. Tethers reliably.
What would that model number be? Thank you.
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AFAIK, there is no current model anymore that carries the 22MP sensor since Kodak discontinued that sensor. The thing that comes closest to what you are asking is the H3DII50.
1) Roughly a frame per second
2) Definitely not
3) It is 3" but clear clean preview is pretty subjective. I think even my Nikons screen is not enough.
4) ISO400, usable & clean to my standards but than again I am not easily scared by some noise.
5) Nothing tethers as reliable as my Valeo did but as long as you are doing single shot it will be pretty reliable.
The 31 is just a bit slower but has a smaller sized sensor but than again better ISO performance.
All these things aside there is a number of things that are well done by Leaf, Phase or even Sinar that I most certainly would welcome for Hasselblad as well. None of the systems are complete but I can work with the Hasselblad, I like working with it and it delivers what I need but indeed YMMV.
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I use a Mac and have had absolutely no problems with Phocus tethered or not. Just works with no problems. I have 4 megs of RAM and shoot and process 16 bit but I haven't moved up to Snow Leopard yet so can't say about that.
I find Phocus to work very much like Lightroom which I used for two years. And I also used C1 so Phocus is doing a good job for me. Even before I bought my Hasselblad I felt that there was a distinct bias in here against Hasselblad. But different people have different experiences with things so all I can do is go by my short history with Hassy.
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I have recently dumped all my Canon gear for the H3DII- 50 - for me the decision came done to price and the quality of the lenses.
Steven
www.friedmanphoto.com
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I am meeting a lot of photographers that use the Hasselblad H3d systems and are very happy with them but on this forum all I seem to see is Phase One users. Hasselblad has some very attractive packages on the H3D 39 and the new H4D 60 and I was wondering what are peoples experiences with them compared with Phase One? My biggest issue with Phase is the Mamiya system which I used to use in the film days and hated it. If I invest in MF then I need a totally integrated system for most work.
So what's the scoop on Hasselblad? Thanks.
I'll be more direct in answering why ...on this forum all I seem to see is Phase One users.
It's no secret that MR is no fan of Hasselblad, and he has gone out of his way to make that very clear.
Many PhaseOne owners share MR's feelings towards Hasselblad.
Nearly all of the Hasselblad users that I've spoken with think LL is a good website but have chosen to move on or participate less because of this bias. I visit here much less too, but I still come here because I feel this is a good forum and website, however, sometimes the anti-H momma-drama gets out of hand.
As you've probably noticed, the PhaseOne salesman jumped in; that happens a lot here and on other forums; he's gotten much better, but he needs to spread the PhaseOne name brand around, so he's using these forums to advertise and sell. He needs to eat I guess.
As far as Hasselblad goes, I use the H3DII39 and I'm extremely happy with both the results and the service I get from Hasselblad.
Hasselblad's Phocus software works great, it's a 64-bit software solution and I've not had any trouble working in on Vista 64. I shoot to CF.
The HC[D] lenses deliver outstanding quality; I've travelled with them all over North America, shooting for about 5 years.
I looked at the PhaseOne camera and I liked the viewfinder on the H platform much more. I also liked the complete lens line up on the H; it exists where as PhaseOne is still getting up to speed with their new lenses. I also liked knowing that Hasselblad has invested considerably into R&D on new products such as the HTS and the new zoom lens. I also prefer an integrated system, one vendor, one source for support and no finger pointing.
Be guided accordingly.
Kind regards,
Derek Jecxz
http://www.jecxz.com (http://www.jecxz.com)
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I have an H3DII-31 and I am very happy with it.
I don't shoot tethered. I have had some stability issues with earlier versions of Phocus but the most recent updates seem OK, and I look forward to version 2. (Nick T - any idea on release date for version 2? Any sneaky hints as to new features, or is it all under NDA?)
As someone moving up from 35mm dSLRs, the systems integration was if anything a bit of a plus for me. Everything runs from the same battery, for example, which makes it easier to pack for a day in the field.
The bottom line is that the images from the Hasselblad have really re-ignited my enthusiasm for photography which is a good thing when it is the way I make my living. The camera is a joy to use and although it has flaws (most particularly the LCD display, which is really only useful for looking at the histogram!) it also has some very strong plus points which mattered to me (like base ISO 100 because of the microlenses, which as I hand hold a lot is important).
But as others have said, try every system you think might suit you before you buy. Pro Centre in London let me hire a camera for the day and offered to refund the hire fee if I purchased a system, which was nice of them. I'd certainly want to try the Leica and Mamiya/Phase options if I were buying now.
Cheers, Hywel
actually I found the histogram a big step up coming from Leaf.
the H3d's screen was crap but the H3dII was a big improvement.
Also not enough people point out how convenient it is using the same battery to power the back and camera. previously either the camera or back would run out of juice at the wrong time, twice the room for problems.
(although it would be great if the battery on the H3d lasted longer)
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I still have a bad taste in my mouth from the H1, and Blad never really penetrated the market in NYC among pros. Everyone was Leaf or Phase on an H1 then H2, AFd, or RZ when I was making the switch to digital
This goes back to the H1. The first one I picked up, at Calumet, couldn't advance the film. The second one I tried shooting handheld with an Imacon back attached, the same way I would shoot an RZ. Blurred frames from the mirror. I used one with a Sinar 54m, locked down on a tripod. Great frames until the H1 threw some error messages then stopped working. I thought the H was a piece of shit, hard to work with, uncomfortable hand cramping etc. For me, I wrote the H off. In fact, aside from the shutter lag, the Mamiya AFd is, to me, a much better handling camera. I like the RZ with a back on it WAY better than the H. I like the RZ lenses better than the H lenses, except for the 100 2.2.
In NYC everyone knows C1 and then Leaf Capture. Few people know Flex or Phocus. Few places rent the H3 system, or at least I've never seen it on their price lists. I think people who own their own gear use the H3 system. Lots of advanced amateurs use them. I've seen files from the 39 and 31, and think they are really pretty at defaults in Flex. Not Leaf pretty, but nicer than the clinical over sharpened Phase defaults from C1 3.x.
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Capture Intergraiton do a fantastic job selling Phase One stuff and servicing Phase One customers - I know because I bought a P45+ Phamiya and a bunch of other stuff from them. The company is great and goes out of its way to be helpful. My only complaint about Capture Intergration is that they sell the second best or third best system.
Comparing the Phamiya body in any guise next to an H body is very very very funny - as there is no comparison. Every time a new Phamiya lens comes out the net is inundated with pics of just how good the Phamya D series lenses are - and I look at them ...and see ummm yeah ..nearly as good as what H users have enjoyed for 10 years already. Then you got the really really excellent C! software - much better than Phocus - why? Well because all these guys who shoot Canon and Nikon like it...hahahhahah (joke) I use C! pro for M files.
Meanwhile Hasselblad give their software for free to registered users - for sure less flim flams - but DAC corrections that actually work. Then I use a simple adaptor in front of my H series camera and can use all the V lenses I have as well - the camera immediately recognises what I am shooting and the software applies DAC corrections as well there - if I want.
Hasselblad is just an easier system to use than anything else out there - and I guess will always bring out their version of a big boy sensor many months after Phase One does _ I gues that is the only thing that Hasselblad comes second in - megapixels and for all the 50 or so photographers that care - that is a big deal. Oh the other advantage that Phase On enjoys over Hasselblad in a P+ series camera is long exposures - Hasselblad goes (only) up to a minute....Phase One goes for hours. Again if that is important to you - well you will have to put up with third rate body and second rate lenses but you do get a long exposure.
The one thing that really upsets me about Hasselblad? - typing the silly name of my camera H3D11-39 I mean come on - thats just a stoopid naming convention - dont they care abotu how hard it is for peopel to type it easily?
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Capture Intergraiton do a fantastic job selling Phase One stuff and servicing Phase One customers - I know because I bought a P45+ Phamiya and a bunch of other stuff from them. The company is great and goes out of its way to be helpful. My only complaint about Capture Intergration is that they sell the second best or third best system.
Comparing the Phamiya body in any guise next to an H body is very very very funny - as there is no comparison. Every time a new Phamiya lens comes out the net is inundated with pics of just how good the Phamya D series lenses are - and I look at them ...and see ummm yeah ..nearly as good as what H users have enjoyed for 10 years already. Then you got the really really excellent C! software - much better than Phocus - why? Well because all these guys who shoot Canon and Nikon like it...hahahhahah (joke) I use C! pro for M files.
Meanwhile Hasselblad give their software for free to registered users - for sure less flim flams - but DAC corrections that actually work. Then I use a simple adaptor in front of my H series camera and can use all the V lenses I have as well - the camera immediately recognises what I am shooting and the software applies DAC corrections as well there - if I want.
Hasselblad is just an easier system to use than anything else out there - and I guess will always bring out their version of a big boy sensor many months after Phase One does _ I gues that is the only thing that Hasselblad comes second in - megapixels and for all the 50 or so photographers that care - that is a big deal. Oh the other advantage that Phase On enjoys over Hasselblad in a P+ series camera is long exposures - Hasselblad goes (only) up to a minute....Phase One goes for hours. Again if that is important to you - well you will have to put up with third rate body and second rate lenses but you do get a long exposure.
The one thing that really upsets me about Hasselblad? - typing the silly name of my camera H3D11-39 I mean come on - thats just a stoopid naming convention - dont they care abotu how hard it is for peopel to type it easily?
A lot of good points here. Yes I do sense an anti-hasselblad bias, maybe from some issues at the H1 system's start, or whatever. But so many rental houses use the H2 system with Phase backs that it's obvious the Hasselblad lenses and camera bodies are well proven. Imacon was no slouch technically when they took over the desktop scanning business from Leaf, which was quite an achievement . As so many have said, when I get back in town I'm going to go out and start testing the different systems against each other as well as against my own 1Ds3 images. Once I've established there is a quantifiable difference, then I'll deal with the hardware and software idiosyncrasies of each..
Thanks for all the info.
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I'll be more direct in answering why ...on this forum all I seem to see is Phase One users.
It's no secret that MR is no fan of Hasselblad, and he has gone out of his way to make that very clear.
Many PhaseOne owners share MR's feelings towards Hasselblad.
Kind regards,
Derek Jecxz
http://www.jecxz.com (http://www.jecxz.com)
That's quite surprising since I really respect MR and the job he has done with this website and his tutorials. I know at one point he was obviously disappointed with Hasselblad locking out other back manufactures from their new systems. His site is the first place I go to get impressions of the latest gear and his opinion weighs heavily on my buying decisions. Never considered him bias. Now that you mention it, he has never done a comparison of the two systems. It would be quite a test to see how their latest systems match up as far as image quality.
And what do feelings towards equipment companies have to do with our business of making art or images? I hate Nikon for forcing me to dump all my gear a few years ago when they appeared to have totally abandoned the professionals that made Nikon who they were. But if I needed to buy a Nikon because it would help my work - my bias against them as a company wouldn't stop me from it.
They are only tools.
IMO - thanks for listening.
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A lot of good points here. Yes I do sense an anti-hasselblad bias, maybe from some issues at the H1 system's start, or whatever. But so many rental houses use the H2 system with Phase backs that it's obvious the Hasselblad lenses and camera bodies are well proven.
A lot of on the street talk about digital backs is from the past, or the stuff of urban legends.
I believe Leaf got the reputation for being more film like because early on V-8 was limited to the basics in processing, v10 was unstable and had a whole slew of problems so most Leaf files were processed in early CS1 and CS2 which gave a grain effect to .mos files, hence the reputation for film like.
Hasselblad early on had that tethered tank thing and the Imacon/hasselblad backs were usually one stop and one step behind phase so they got passed by.
Phase with version 3 software was the most stable of the medium format systems (at the time) and became more of the standard, though 90% of all professional images shot with Phase backs were shot with H series bodies. I think some of that stability equity has been given up with the issues of V4, it may return with V5 though only time will tell.
I find the testing, buying process of medium format interesting because few photographers I know have actually taken a Canon, a Leaf, a Phase and a Blad and actually compared them in their real world shooting styles.
Most just shoot a few dozen frames at a dealer or of some assistant in their studio, write the check and then try to find a way to make the system work for them. I've done it both ways, buying blind and buying through testing and I can promise you that the "film like look" of any digital camera has as much to do with subject, lighting, choice of processor as it does anything that relates to hardware. That was in the Phase/Hasselblad Kodak sensor, Leaf/Sinar Dalsa sensor days and now that everyone seems to mix and match everything I guess there is not that much difference.
I do know that the time I briefly tested the blad file in Flexcolor, compared to the Phase and Leaf, using HMI's the hasselblad file had the prettiest skin tones, though I didn't go the Hasselblad route because the file would only work (at the time) in flexcolor and the pre production 39 mpx back I tested was slow, though later versions were faster.
In fact under certain conditions the Leaf can be very film like, but shooting translucent skin can be a magenta nightmare, but issues can and do happen with every digital back because they all behave differently under different conditions. The Phase P30+ is very nice under tungsten light, the Aptus 22 good under most strobes, though the A-22 I owned was a moire machine. Once again they all have their plus and minuses, though Hasselblad has one thing no other maker can match and that's a autofocus 100mm F 2.2 fast lens. For a lot of money work, this is a magic focal length and 2.2 is fast and offers a lot of artistic options.
Doing it again, or starting fresh, I would probably go with Hasselblad, if only because it takes one battery to run the whole system and I think their contribution to the industry is strong, especially in the way they market and feature their photographers.
They have a respectful way of presenting the work of their clientele and that goes a long way with me.
IMO
JR
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I still have a bad taste in my mouth from the H1, and Blad never really penetrated the market in NYC among pros. Everyone was Leaf or Phase on an H1 then H2, AFd, or RZ when I was making the switch to digital
This goes back to the H1. The first one I picked up, at Calumet, couldn't advance the film. The second one I tried shooting handheld with an Imacon back attached, the same way I would shoot an RZ. Blurred frames from the mirror. I used one with a Sinar 54m, locked down on a tripod. Great frames until the H1 threw some error messages then stopped working. I thought the H was a piece of shit, hard to work with, uncomfortable hand cramping etc. For me, I wrote the H off. In fact, aside from the shutter lag, the Mamiya AFd is, to me, a much better handling camera. I like the RZ with a back on it WAY better than the H. I like the RZ lenses better than the H lenses, except for the 100 2.2.
In NYC everyone knows C1 and then Leaf Capture. Few people know Flex or Phocus. Few places rent the H3 system, or at least I've never seen it on their price lists. I think people who own their own gear use the H3 system. Lots of advanced amateurs use them. I've seen files from the 39 and 31, and think they are really pretty at defaults in Flex. Not Leaf pretty, but nicer than the clinical over sharpened Phase defaults from C1 3.x.
How many years ago was the H1? jeez, get past it.
Everyone you know? There are over 18,000,000 people in New York City. I think every day starts with today and holding grudges for something that happened years ago when ALL companies were feeling there way through digital is not really a productive approach, do you think? I, for one, am very happy with my Hasselblad, camera, back, lenses and Phocus. I came in with no pre-disposition to anything whether it was Phase, mamiya, hasselblad, etc. but the rants against Hasselblad in here are so emotional I just let them go and used my brain. I am very happy I did.
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Phocus uses OpenGL commands extensively for speed of display, so it is important to have a strong graphics card with 512MB VRAM. Please pass our info over to your friend, happy to see if we can help him/her out.
-John
hotwire-digital.com
Oh, thanks John, i will as soon as possible many thanks again
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I have been asking around about Hasselblad tethering, for an upcoming job in California. These guys were recommended to me, if you want Hasselblad tech and tethering.
Just trying to provide a public service here, and stay positive about Phocus, under pressure:
http://150kilos.com/ (http://150kilos.com/)
However, the word I got from a trusted source is that Phase and Leaf are the solid leaders, and shooting speed is not Hasselblad's forte.
Maybe it would be fine, if shooting product or the like.
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I have been asking around about Hasselblad tethering, for an upcoming job in California. These guys were recommended to me, if you want Hasselblad tech and tethering.
Just trying to provide a public service here, and stay positive about Phocus, under pressure:
http://150kilos.com/ (http://150kilos.com/)
However, the word I got from a trusted source is that Phase and Leaf are the solid leaders, and shooting speed is not Hasselblad's forte.
Maybe it would be fine, if shooting product or the like.
Your trusted source is not trusted, as it simply doesn't stand anymore.
Anyway, don't take it from me, try an H3D50 tethered.
...Plus I can certainly vouch for 150Kilos. Extremely professional and work with photographers who would not accept anything less.
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Your trusted source is not trusted, as it simply doesn't stand anymore.
Trust me, my source is trusted.
As an aside, if you mounted a P30+ onto an H2 body, could you buy the "magnifying viewfinder" for the H2, and mount that viewfinder onto the H2, and thus, the H2 becomes "full frame", at least in how you're seeing it through the viewfinder?
IOW, if you had two bodies in front of you:
1) H2 with P65+, with normal viewfinder.
2) H2 with P30+, but with magnifying viewfinder.
And you put both cameras on tripods in front of you, and you looked thru each one, would the viewfinder image that you see be the same size?
Are there any downsides of using the magnifying viewfinder? Would duct tape be involved in any way, in my approach?
Thank you.
PS. If I only buy from Doug Peterson, but I wanted Hasselblad, what do I do then? Does Doug moonlight for any Hasselblad dealers?
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Trust me, my source is trusted.
As an aside, if you mounted a P30+ onto an H2 body, could you buy the "magnifying viewfinder" for the H2, and mount that viewfinder onto the H2, and thus, the H2 becomes "full frame", at least in how you're seeing it through the viewfinder?
IOW, if you had two bodies in front of you:
1) H2 with P65+, with normal viewfinder.
2) H2 with P30+, but with magnifying viewfinder.
And you put both cameras on tripods in front of you, and you looked thru each one, would the viewfinder image that you see be the same size?
Are there any downsides of using the magnifying viewfinder? Would duct tape be involved in any way, in my approach?
Thank you.
PS. If I only buy from Doug Peterson, but I wanted Hasselblad, what do I do then? Does Doug moonlight for any Hasselblad dealers?
Trusted maybe, wrong, absolutely.
As for your second question, no.
Doug has been Phase-washed, so you would have to go to another dealer. ;-)
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As for your second question, no.
Locked out, yet again. Oh well. Thanks.
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Locked out, yet again. Oh well. Thanks.
A perfect example of momma-drama!
I knew it would not take long...
Kind regards,
Derek Jecxz
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A perfect example of momma-drama!
I knew it would not take long...
The Million Dollar Question, also known as Poulsen's Dilemma, is: Does it make them invest further in Hasselblad, or does it make them bolt to Nikon/Canon?
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? I don't even understand the question. Are you asking Toyota why you can't buy one of their cars from your local Honda dealer? Locked out yet again!
Hywel.
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How many years ago was the H1? jeez, get past it.
Everyone you know? There are over 18,000,000 people in New York City. I think every day starts with today and holding grudges for something that happened years ago when ALL companies were feeling there way through digital is not really a productive approach, do you think? I, for one, am very happy with my Hasselblad, camera, back, lenses and Phocus. I came in with no pre-disposition to anything whether it was Phase, mamiya, hasselblad, etc. but the rants against Hasselblad in here are so emotional I just let them go and used my brain. I am very happy I did.
Down boy! Its not a rant against Hasselblad. I'm sorry I offended your camera. Give it my apologioes. I was simply explaining why many people I know, from my world, don't rock the Blad. Ghost of the H1, then entrenchment into a system that was rock solid, Phase and C1 3.x or Leaf and V8.
I don't know everyone in New York. I really know probably less than 900 people. Probably 50 of those people I know in New York are professional photographers who use/used backs. Another 6 or so work for or own rental companies. That's the basis for my sample.
I'm not in the market for a back, I have no opinion on the H3 or H4. I never had a grudge against Blad. The H1 being problematic didn't offend me. It was just a fact. I like the idea of the integration of the H3/4, at the same time I don't care. My Aptus on an RZ works well for me, is predictable. I'm glad you like your camera. I'm glad you have some Self Help, AA 12 step philosophy to get you up in the morning. Thats a good thing.
If I were starting fresh from Canon, I would go Blad. Its simple and integrated, like a DSLR. But I'm coming to this with a work flow, and a market, where flexability and speed wins the day, and the day is worth more than I made from 1989 to 1999 put together. Most of the time its the Canon or, scoff, film.
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...don't take it from me, try an H3D50 tethered.
I tried my H3D11-50 tethered, and live view does not work (and they are supposed to notify me when they release updates).
Are you still on track to release the firmware update to make live view work on the H3D11-50 this month?
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Man, I hope my kids never come in here and read this stuff. I wouldn't be able to use my "act like an adult" lesson on them anymore.
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FWIW, I work for a retailer where we shoot product M to F, year-round. I shot with a P25 on a H1 body from June '05 to Jan '09. There was the occasional (once a week?) error on the H1 asking to reconnect the digital back. Hit the release, tilted the P25 back, then re-attached. Problem gone. Other than that, the platform was solid. It also got toted along the West Coast in a backpack, used from boats and helicopters to do shots for a resort.
In Jan '09 we took delivery of a H3D-II 50. Wasn't my choice, but approached it with an open mind. Phocus took a bit of getting used to, but isn't really that difficult if you've been using C1 or something similar. Yes, I'm a bit peeved that we're still waiting for live view. My opinion (a total guess) is that Hasselblad has been busy getting the HTS adapter, the 60MP back and H4 body to market to take the time to get live view working on the 50. It's not an excuse - don't sell it if you can't deliver - however the feature was not integral to the type of work I do.
My other issues have been the rather poor preview in Phocus if you're viewing at 15 to 24%. A quick zoom to 25% renders the raw file (instead of using the embedded JPEG for preview) and all is well. The only time I can crash Phocus is when moving images from one folder to another in Phocus versus the Finder. Even then, that is sporatic. I've been running Phocus on an dual quad core Mac with 8GB of RAM. The other software running at the time is Photoshop CS4, a web browser and remote desktop connected to a Windows server. On a 2008 generation unibody MacBook Pro, Phocus has been mostly stable, though slow to process to RGB. I wouldn't want to process a large number of 50MP files on it.
After 10 months with the H3D-II 50, we'll be upgrading to the 60 early next year. Hopefully live view will work. ;-)
The advice to try both systems is very valid. Find a dealer that is willing to let you use the camera/back for the type of work you do. Save the files and spend another week or two in the respective software. See what works for you. I think the major DB makers all hype their products a little too much and this board seems to have a decidedly anti-Hasselblad bias. Not sure why, other than it's no different than Ford versus Chevy, Mac versus Windows, etc. In reality, the service you get from your dealer will probably be as an important a factor as the manufacturer you go with.
Darren Bernaerdt
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Doug has been Phase-washed, so you would have to go to another dealer. ;-)
I'm not sure if that is necessarily true.
Given time it seems most dealers, reps will have changed the logos on their polo shirts more than Nascar drivers, so if you really want to work with that one special dealer/rep/tech/expert, give it a while cause everything changes.
I don't know a lot but I do know with "medium" format there are 10 close to certain projections.
1. Every time you watch a video of a photographer shooting medium format it's always with an H camera, though not usually with an H back. The video will always include the photographer's assistants loading a Toyota Highlander.
2. Every time somebody on a forum posts 10 questions to a dealer/rep/tech representative only 7 questions are fully answered.
3. Every three years Leaf will have a new users forum.
4. In the year 2015 Phase will still have the same lcd in the same case with the same 4 chrome buttons. This will be called simplicity of design.
5. In the year 2016 medium format will move to cmos buy buying all the used canon cameras in the world and stitching them together to make an almost full frame 645 format sensor.
6. In the year 2017 RED will announce a new Super Full Frame 10meter x 90meter Mysterium camera that is subject to change.
7. In the year 2018 Atlanta will be the only place you can legally buy a medium format camera.
8. In the year 2019 Leica will ship their second S-2 Lens, a Macro, for a discounted price of 18,549 dollars, or euros + import duties, + VAT + currency/market liquidity changes.
9. In the year 2020 all professional photographs will be shot with a robotic medium format Iphone. You just ship the Iphone to location, it sets up the lights, interacts with the subject, argues with the client and shoots the photograph. There will be an A.L. version and it will come with a 12 extra robots that assist with the styling and a law firm on retainer. Two robots will quit in tears.
10. In the year 2021 F+H, Sinar and Kodak will announce they are looking for an investor to resurrect the HY6, though nobody will answer the phone because they're on holiday.
IMO
BC
The above is meant as satirical humor. Any resemblance to real people, corporations or individuals is pure coincidence.
In other words don't anybody get their knickers in a twist.
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BC, I love your posts.
Cheers
Ulf
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hmm, did you edit the post on your own? the hilarious part went missing.
or maybe..big brother watches you
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I am using a H3dII 50, love Phocus and I am very happy with the camera . No problems at all and I do mainly portraiture . I m sure phase is a nice system as well ... didn't like the colours when i tested it though .
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I am using a H3dII 50, love Phocus and I am very happy with the camera . No problems at all and I do mainly portraiture . I m sure phase is a nice system as well ... didn't like the colours when i tested it though .
You better run, someone is going to take a swing at you.
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10. In the year 2021 F+H, Sinar and Kodak will announce they are looking for an investor to resurrect the HY6, though nobody will answer the phone because they're on holiday.
Don't forget #11: In the year 2012, the working default ASA of Canon and Nikon CMOS will be 4,864,822,486, and Hasselblad, Leaf and Phase will still be clinging to CCDs, and still clinging to hope that, one day, they'll get a clean working ASA of 800. At that point, Profoto heads will be the size of Bic Butane cigarette lighters, and will recyle at 24 frames per second, but only put out a little "dink" of light, because at ASA 4,864,822,486, that's all you really need, whereas, the MF CCD guy will ask his assistant to do him a manual "pop" to check the flash meter, and the photographer will say, "trip the profotos" and the assistant will say, "Uh, I just did; it just wasn't bright enough for you to see it".
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My other issues have been the rather poor preview in Phocus if you're viewing at 15 to 24%. A quick zoom to 25% renders the raw file (instead of using the embedded JPEG for preview) and all is well.
This has been resolved with current versions.
The only time I can crash Phocus is when moving images from one folder to another in Phocus versus the Finder.
I'm fairly sure this was a bug that has been fixed.
Phocus has been mostly stable, though slow to process to RGB. I wouldn't want to process a large number of 50MP files on it.
How slow is slow? What times are you getting with "standard" setup (turning on the moire filter for example will slow processing right down)
HTh
Nick-T
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Don't forget #11: In the year 2012, the working default ASA of Canon and Nikon CMOS will be 4,864,822,486, and Hasselblad, Leaf and Phase will still be clinging to CCDs, and still clinging to hope that, one day, they'll get a clean working ASA of 800. At that point, Profoto heads will be the size of Bic Butane cigarette lighters, and will recyle at 24 frames per second, but only put out a little "dink" of light, because at ASA 4,864,822,486, that's all you really need, whereas, the MF CCD guy will ask his assistant to do him a manual "pop" to check the flash meter, and the photographer will say, "trip the profotos" and the assistant will say, "Uh, I just did; it just wasn't bright enough for you to see it".
Are you a bat? They use radar. I use light. Light is photography. The lack of light or the need to be able to shoot in the lack of light is odd to me. Light is photography. The lack of light is darkness. Light shapes, darkness hides.
I'm kidding here but I do not understand the fixation on high ISO's. Are we astronomers or photographers? Voyeurs or photographers? Light is good.
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Hi All,
I started to read this thread and then had to check what it was really all about, so back to the question. I am a very happy H3D 31 user my experience has only been very positive with the whole of Hasselblad. That includes getting great support from hasselblad and a great local support from the supplier CR Kennedy. Phocus as software goes is improving and I think with the announced version 2 we will see a very sound platform to work from. So I am looking forward to the new software and future developments. I also shoot up to 1600 iso on the 31 and am happy with the results for my application.
I also was in a video shooting on the H3D and no Toyota, so go check it out it is up off the main site now.
Regards
Rodney
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You better run, someone is going to take a swing at you.
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To put things into perspective...
We are guilty of thinking that USA/Europe is the world in it's entirety... or some members think that maybe even that New York is the world in it's entirety.
I am currently spending an interesting week in South Korea with our distributor...
www.hasselkorea.co.kr
Nice website which they produced themselves, based on the 'look' of ours, but they had no outside help.
They have translated every page. For example...
http://www.hasselkorea.co.kr/sub/02_HK_Pro...05H50_Main.html (http://www.hasselkorea.co.kr/sub/02_HK_Product_05H50_Main.html)
We then spoke about forums. This forum (LL) has 33,000+ subscribers worldwide. One of the photographic forums I was shown had upwards of one million subscribers in Korea alone.
And you think only Luminous Landscape can do reviews?
http://www.slrclub.com/bbs/vx2.php?id=slr_...=asc&no=148 (http://www.slrclub.com/bbs/vx2.php?id=slr_review&page=1&sn1=&sid1=&divpage=1&sn=off&sid=off&ss=on&sc=off&select_arrange=headnum&desc=asc&no=148)
South Korea is the forth largest economy in Asia, is stuffed full of high tech, has the highest broadband access per capita, the world's largest ship builder and a car industry that hasn't gone down the toilet. They also make a mean BBQ dinner.
...and thanks to Wikipedia, here is one more... The world's largest flat screen display manufacturer.
;-)
My point being is that as 'big' as Luminous Landscape is to the English Speaking world, it is insignificant elsewhere.
Best Regards,
David
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My other issues have been the rather poor preview in Phocus if you're viewing at 15 to 24%. A quick zoom to 25% renders the raw file (instead of using the embedded JPEG for preview) and all is well.
I am willing to bet you have your Embedded Preview Size set to Small in preferences?
Change it to large and you will see a marked improvement.
David
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I am willing to bet you have your Embedded Preview Size set to Small in preferences?
Change it to large and you will see a marked improvement.
David
David, if you've captured to "small embedded preview" from the 3fr file and only have the fff file left, can you "reprocess" it to embed a large preview? I have 10,000+ images captured on my MacBook with the small preview setting which I'd really like to be able to sort in Phocus on my MacPro- to do that, I really need to see if the image is sharp. It isn't a deal-breaker to zoom up to 25%, but would be nice to batch process overnight to fix it instead.
Capturing with large embedded preview is fine for new stuff, can you reprocess 3fr's to get large previews?
Cheers, Hywel.
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David, if you've captured to "small embedded preview" from the 3fr file and only have the fff file left, can you "reprocess" it to embed a large preview? I have 10,000+ images captured on my MacBook with the small preview setting which I'd really like to be able to sort in Phocus on my MacPro- to do that, I really need to see if the image is sharp. It isn't a deal-breaker to zoom up to 25%, but would be nice to batch process overnight to fix it instead.
Capturing with large embedded preview is fine for new stuff, can you reprocess 3fr's to get large previews?
Cheers, Hywel.
That's a good question and I will enquire.
Yes, you can reprocess 3FR's to get larger previews. This is when the preview is created.
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Are you a bat? They use radar. I use light. Light is photography. The lack of light or the need to be able to shoot in the lack of light is odd to me. Light is photography. The lack of light is darkness. Light shapes, darkness hides.
I'm kidding here but I do not understand the fixation on high ISO's. Are we astronomers or photographers? Voyeurs or photographers? Light is good.
Yes, light is good but to a degree. It depends what you're after. Lower light levels makes the light less obvious in a shot, thus making the image feel more natural. So quality becomes more important than quantity.
Its easy for amateurs or those who shoot fashion ala 1980's look to over-light a set and feel like they're now a pro, but feeling and embracing the light often happens when its at much lower levels.
Having an excellent 400 iso option and good 800 is a must when working in natural light with artificial light source as a complement. I love the detail of my P45, but at low light levels, unless I'm on a tripod, 99% I will reach for my Canon. There is obvious limitations with CCD's that keep them from getting to higher ISO levels, but its the fact that nothing is changing in MF, while DSLRs keep moving forward.
The name of the post is "what about Hasselblad"- I say...Hassy, Phase, Leaf and Sinar are all the same to a degree when there is lot of light on the set. The only thing that sets them apart is software and workflow. For years photographers have been asking for bigger sensors, better LCDs, higher ISOs, not to mention cameras we can connect with, instead we get more MP and now higher prices with crap upgrade paths.
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That's a good question and I will enquire.
Yes, you can reprocess 3FR's to get larger previews. This is when the preview is created.
Thanks- figured that was when the preview was created.
Would be nice to reprocess the fff's to re-embed the preview if you chose the wrong settings initially
Makes me think I probably should back up the 3FR's as well in future, just in case. Double the storage space which is annoying- although I think Phocus can preview 3FR without importing (and hence creating the FFFs) these days? On my laptop I generally just want a quick flick through to make sure things are OK, and the laptop is the thing with limited storage space where having two versions of each 50 MB capture was an issue. Which is why I captured direct from the card, and didn't save the 3FR's.
I may be forced to move from Aperture to Lightroom for DAM and basic retouching, at least in the short term, and so 3FR archiving supports other workflows that might be useful, too. At least I'd be able to see the unprocessed images in my library. It is annoying that Lightroom won't even acknowledge the existence of the FFF's- makes managing them a pain. (Hooray for Aperture at least seeing them, even if its treatment of colours of FFF files is quite odd and nothing like as lovely as the output from Phocus. But boo- Aperture just plain curls up and dies when presented with a hundred 180 MB 16-bit TIFFs to retouch and export, especially if you try to use a plugin like Portraiture. Hence the probable move to LR).
My ideal of course would be for Phocus to do the stuff I need from Aperture/LR, which would remove a step from my processing workflow and have me dancing hallelujahs. Non-destructive local healing and dust spot/clone brush, output sharpening, image watermark overlay on export, and ideally some sort of automask plus smoothing for skintones a la the Portraiture plugin and I could forget Aperture/Lightroom/Photoshop for 95+% of my work, which would be AMAZING.
Cheers, Hywel.
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Yes, light is good but to a degree. It depends what you're after. Lower light levels makes the light less obvious in a shot, thus making the image feel more natural. So quality becomes more important than quantity.
Its easy for amateurs or those who shoot fashion ala 1980's look to over-light a set and feel like they're now a pro, but feeling and embracing the light often happens when its at much lower levels.
Having an excellent 400 iso option and good 800 is a must when working in natural light with artificial light source as a complement. I love the detail of my P45, but at low light levels unless I'm on a tripod, 99% I will reach for my Canon. There is obvious limitations with CCD's that keep them from getting to higher ISO levels, but its the fact that nothing is changing in MF while DSLRs keep moving forward.
The name of the post is "what about Hasselblad"- I say...Hassy, Phase, Leaf and Sinar are all the same to a degree when there is lot of light on the set. The only thing that sets them apart is software and workflow. For years photographers have been asking for bigger sensors, better LCDs, higher ISOs, not to mention cameras we can connect with, instead we get more MP and now higher prices with crap upgrade paths.
Yes, to all points.
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To put things into perspective...
We are guilty of thinking that USA/Europe is the world in it's entirety...
David
Dave,
I don't think most of us who have worked and shot in world markets consider the U.S., western Europe, or even NY the only place great photography is produced. In fact I think Hong Kong is probably as advanced as any city I've worked, the crews the most capable, the work ethic off the wall.
I love the people in Seoul, they run at a different pace than HK or Tokyo, but they are nice, honest, gentle and very positive. Also very smart.
Tokyo to me is the most different, to a westerner, but I love working with Japanese clients, it just takes a different mind set when it comes to communication and a course in being respectful but for any photographer to think that any country or market is the ONLY place would be very short sided.
Maybe that's your point.
JR
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That's a good question and I will enquire.
For everyone sorry for the long post.
David,
Take this is the best possible way.
I have to admit I'm a little confused about medium format. Leaf has about 4 names for the same back, Phase seems to be going to the Dalsa route, leaving Kodak behind but now that they have Leaf and Mamiya it takes a play book to know what a dl22 is over a Mamiya ZD2, vs a Leaf 5 and Hasselblad seems to have come leaps and bounds since the Imacon days, but there are things I don't really understand about the Hasselblad system.
If I could get all three of the medium format players into an interview room I'd asked a series of questions, but since you are in the room, here goes. Don't worry, I'm not going to mention lcd's and higher iso because I think at this stage we all know that medium format is what it is so the questions I'm asking are exactly what I would need to know if I decided to change camera systems.
1. What is the Hasselblad file format? Are there two, or three and if so why? I hear fff and 3fr thrown around, even dng, but if you shoot to a cf card what is the format and is it the same format as if you tether? Are any of these formats good in 3rd party processors?
2. What is the plan for Hasselblad in regards to sensors? Are you following phase and going to dalsa, are you continuing with Kodak, is there that much of a difference?
3. What computers can run a new Hasselblad camera tethered? I hear about graphic cards updates, but I'm curious because I carry a lot of computers from the latest one piece intel macbook pros, the the 2.16 version, previous generation 24" white imacs and 8 core intel towers.
I use the Imacs in studio, the intel books on a tripod in studio and on location, the tower to process after a shoot, so what are the requirements to run clean, fast and stable with Phocus? Does moving to Hasselblad require brand new computers?
4. What is the raw file size of a Hasselblad file? This may seem trivial but for a lot of us file size is becoming overburdening. Every project at the end of every day we have the raw files on three drives. Once completed, sorted and renamed, we make a master set of files, then test and copy those files
to two backup drives (one going to two of our studios, one going straight to the retoucher). A small job can grow to a terabyte with backups so the smaller in the better.
I know I asked this in a previous question, but if Hasselblad has different file formats how do you view, edit rename and archive the files? If (and once again I'm not clear on what the hasselblad file format is) but do you have to store the hasselblad files in two different formats for safety and compatibility going forward?
With the Phase, Canons and Nikons I do my early sort and renaming in I-view (now Expression media) because it's fast and it allows a manual drag and drop of files. In other words if I shoot two cameras of the same scene I can just drag my selects next to each other rename and they are ready to archive?
Can I do this with Phocus, can the Hasselblad raws work in Expression media, photo mechanic, lightroom?
5. Raw file size again. Is there a way to compress the raw files without loss of quality? This may seem like a trivial question but we shoot thousands of images per job, make sometimes a dozen web galleries per project, the retouching of dozens to hundreds of images in layered form get huge and even though drive space is somewhat gone down in price, file sizes have outpaced the drive costs, so anything that makes the file format smaller is greatly welcomed.
6. Learning curve. This is a big one. I like many others have zero free time, my crew less. I know these systems take time to learn, but is Phocus intuitive like Lightroom, is it easy and robust to tether like eos utility? If I give a copy of Phocus to my retoucher can she get up to speed on processing in minutes hours, days? Can I make my color settings in the Hasselblad raw file and it carry on to her machine without reseting everything, like a side car file or a sessions folder and most importantly since 95% of all retouchers want a raw file, even if I ship a processed Tiff, and since 95% of retouchers process in CS3 or 4, does the Hasselblad file work in those programs?
7. Backups. OK, I'm probably too careful, but I don't think I've ever gone out on set without two of almost everything. I have two digital backs, 4 canons two nikons and multiple lenses. I know I can rent H lenses almost anywhere, but lets say I moved to a H3dII or H4d, can I rent one in most studios, most major markets in case mine goes down.
8. Tech service. For small things such as software, I know most good dealers can give me the information, but really tricky stuff, or if equipment goes down, is there a direct to factory line that I can call for troubleshooting and fast repair? Canon has CPS that turns stuff around in a day or two and Leaf of America use to have in Rick A. great turnaround time, (though the camera went in too often), but at least there was a person that actually returned calls, had direct factory access and didn't have to set up a repair case that they forwarded to the factory and then had to wait for the reply then give me the reply.
In other words in I owned an H4d can I call someone and get an answer that moment and if it's hardware related can I get a quick turnaround of repairs, even if I'm willing to pay extra?
9. In camera jpegs. This sounds like a small thing, but I've found in camera jpegs to be invaluable for our workflow. We shoot a lot of images, have fast turnaround times and a properly shot in camera jpeg can be thrown into lightroom for quick adjustments and web galleries saving hours, sometimes days and when you are producing images for fpo at about 1200 pixels across working a jpeg is a lot faster than waiting for previews to build in the raw files and software. Is there a plan for Hasselblad to produce jpegs out of camera?
10. this is the big one. Why would I put down my Phase backs, Canons and go with Hasselblad? What are the clear advantages? In the last few years all of our productions have become larger with higher expectations. The last project we shot was perfect for medium format because it was in studio, we used as much quantity of light we desired, but the catch was this was a project with so much production so many models that even 1 hour of overtime is the costs of a new 1ds3. In prelight, we set up the Phase backs on one computer station, we hooked up the 1ds3's to another station and started lighting.
With the Phase I had a glitch in v4 so we moved to v 3 and it ran ok, but was obviously slower than the Canons. With the Canons I plugged in the usb cord and started shooting and side by side on identical 24" monitors nobody in the room could see that much of a difference in the files and formats and one of the 4 AD's in the room preferred the 1ds3 previews because they were smoother and in his words more film like that the previews in Phase Version 3. (he was right).
OK, I know in post production there's sometimes is a difference and given my way I'd probably shoot with medium format but given the fact I had about twenty seconds to make the decision I went with the 1ds3's.
I'm not pushing Canon, I'm not pushing any brand, but do this............ put yourself in the photographer's shoes for a moment. I can go with a system that is slower, takes a dedicated tech to stand by and tether, requires later jpeg processing from slow to build previews for editing in proprietary software or I can take any I phone savvy assistant and in 30 minutes get him/her up to speed using eos utility.
For this last project we shot over 10,000 frames all tethered to eos utility and had one crash because the cf card was pulled during a buffer. 1 crash!
Can I get this sort of reliability from your system?
11. Film looks. I want this stuff to look like film. I want beautiful skin tones, pull down menus and plug ins like alien skin where I can pick nc100, fuji ultra, or polaroid. I know we're going to work an image in post later on, but I do want my client to see the closest look at time of capture as possible.
Will your software do this, are there third party plug ins?
12. The used car lot. OK, let's be realistic these cameras costs the price of cars and like cars they depreciate quickly. I'm not an e-bay guy, don't see the point of hustling equipment to make an extra $500. When the time comes for me to make a change I want to sell my older cameras quickly, safely, legally and cleanly. With the Canons I just box them up and hand them to my dealer who sells them on consignment at a good price. They usually sell in about two weeks. I keep doing my job which is shooting the dealer does there's which is selling cameras and life goes on.
Why not a clearing house or consignment store for medium format. If I decided today to forego my two Phase backs and the Contax' and go with your system, what is the plan, how do I do this without taking a huge bath?
Why not sell these things like cars, where you have the used camera lot, maybe with a camerafax report on use, repairs, shot count. Why not make it easy for me or others to switch systems without becoming a e-bay power ranger or seller or whatever they are called?
Just a thought.
13. How we work. OK I know you guys know a lot of photographers and everybody shoots and works differently, but how about coming on set for pre production and a casting session of 800 models. How bout coming to the digital techs hotel room to correct, process, sort and rename 2,000 files a day, starting at 8pm?
Then follow the job along with me as we go from client review of images, comp mark ups, retouching notes, retouching galleries all the way to final delivery. You just can't get a grasp on what we do until you pull those twenty hour days with many 6 figures on the line.
Maybe you've done this and if so I stand corrected.
14. Transparency. Nothing sends a customer more loopy than to have a dealer or tech rep say, "uh centerfold, we've seen no centerfold" only to see a firmware release three weeks later saying "the centerfold is now fixed". I've gone this route with the manufacturers tech disavowing centerfold, over heating, overshooting, green previews half black frames, only to get a different response and a fix a year later. Is hasselblad up front about issues, do you get in front of the story or react months later with a partial fix, or even worse never fix that camera, just fix it on the next upgrade? In my view medium format has lost a lot of credibility by not being transparent and getting in front of the issues.
In summary I hope you take this with the best on intentions. I'm not dissing blad or medium format in general I'm just genuinely asking how your system works and plans for the future.
If you ask me what camera I want it's probably something like a big 1ds3, or a digital Pentax 6x7. I want a switch on the back to go from 4:3 to 2:3 to square format and the image crops are reflected in the software. I want real film like looks that are on a pull down menu, I want software that is dead ass simple, dead ass stable, intuitive and I want to be sure I can afford or have backups of everything.
I want to upgrade without haggling over price, I want to know the company will be around when needed, from support to repairs and I don't want to see silly add on warranties unless they are completely useful. I want the numbers up front, including upgrades and I want that GM 60 day return warranty.
In other words I don't want to walk out of the dealer with buyer's remorse.
I don't want to feel like I just bought a $50,000 Ford by the time I get air conditioning and floor mats I want the service and support of a $50,000 Lexus.
Is Hasselblad a Lexus?
Thx.
BC
-
My point being is that as 'big' as Luminous Landscape is to the English Speaking world, it is insignificant elsewhere.
Anybody thinking different needs a serious reality check... and you didn't even mention China.
Cheers,
Bernard
-
The tone of this is just shitty.
To put things into perspective...
We are guilty of thinking that USA/Europe is the world in it's entirety... or some members think that maybe even that New York is the world in it's entirety.
I am currently spending an interesting week in South Korea with our distributor...
www.hasselkorea.co.kr
Nice website which they produced themselves, based on the 'look' of ours, but they had no outside help.
They have translated every page. For example...
http://www.hasselkorea.co.kr/sub/02_HK_Pro...05H50_Main.html (http://www.hasselkorea.co.kr/sub/02_HK_Product_05H50_Main.html)
We then spoke about forums. This forum (LL) has 33,000+ subscribers worldwide. One of the photographic forums I was shown had upwards of one million subscribers in Korea alone.
And you think only Luminous Landscape can do reviews?
http://www.slrclub.com/bbs/vx2.php?id=slr_...=asc&no=148 (http://www.slrclub.com/bbs/vx2.php?id=slr_review&page=1&sn1=&sid1=&divpage=1&sn=off&sid=off&ss=on&sc=off&select_arrange=headnum&desc=asc&no=148)
South Korea is the forth largest economy in Asia, is stuffed full of high tech, has the highest broadband access per capita, the world's largest ship builder and a car industry that hasn't gone down the toilet. They also make a mean BBQ dinner.
...and thanks to Wikipedia, here is one more... The world's largest flat screen display manufacturer.
;-)
My point being is that as 'big' as Luminous Landscape is to the English Speaking world, it is insignificant elsewhere.
Best Regards,
David
-
The tone of this is just shitty.
No wish to offend TMARK. I think we are all guilty (me as well) of not thinking outside our own world.
We all have our ideas on what markets are big and powerful and I had underestimated some of the so called 'smaller' countries.
So once again, apologies if my tone did not come across well. Places like LL are still enormously valuable but not unique in global terms.
David.
-
For everyone sorry for the long post.
David,
Take this is the best possible way.
BIG SNIP
No problem. Apologies for not replying ASAP but duty calls. Ill work through it tonight and tomorrow. All fair questions.
-
For everyone sorry for the long post.
David,
Take this is the best possible way.
I have to admit I'm a little confused about medium format. Leaf has about 4 names for the same back, Phase seems to be going to the Dalsa route, leaving Kodak behind but now that they have Leaf and Mamiya it takes a play book to know what a dl22 is over a Mamiya ZD2, vs a Leaf 5 and Hasselblad seems to have come leaps and bounds since the Imacon days, but there are things I don't really understand about the Hasselblad system.
If I could get all three of the medium format players into an interview room I'd asked a series of questions, but since you are in the room, here goes. Don't worry, I'm not going to mention lcd's and higher iso because I think at this stage we all know that medium format is what it is so the questions I'm asking are exactly what I would need to know if I decided to change camera systems.
1. What is the Hasselblad file format? Are there two, or three and if so why? I hear fff and 3fr thrown around, even dng, but if you shoot to a cf card what is the format and is it the same format as if you tether? Are any of these formats good in 3rd party processors?
2. What is the plan for Hasselblad in regards to sensors? Are you following phase and going to dalsa, are you continuing with Kodak, is there that much of a difference?
3. What computers can run a new Hasselblad camera tethered? I hear about graphic cards updates, but I'm curious because I carry a lot of computers from the latest one piece intel macbook pros, the the 2.16 version, previous generation 24" white imacs and 8 core intel towers.
I use the Imacs in studio, the intel books on a tripod in studio and on location, the tower to process after a shoot, so what are the requirements to run clean, fast and stable with Phocus? Does moving to Hasselblad require brand new computers?
4. What is the raw file size of a Hasselblad file? This may seem trivial but for a lot of us file size is becoming overburdening. Every project at the end of every day we have the raw files on three drives. Once completed, sorted and renamed, we make a master set of files, then test and copy those files
to two backup drives (one going to two of our studios, one going straight to the retoucher). A small job can grow to a terabyte with backups so the smaller in the better.
I know I asked this in a previous question, but if Hasselblad has different file formats how do you view, edit rename and archive the files? If (and once again I'm not clear on what the hasselblad file format is) but do you have to store the hasselblad files in two different formats for safety and compatibility going forward?
With the Phase, Canons and Nikons I do my early sort and renaming in I-view (now Expression media) because it's fast and it allows a manual drag and drop of files. In other words if I shoot two cameras of the same scene I can just drag my selects next to each other rename and they are ready to archive?
Can I do this with Phocus, can the Hasselblad raws work in Expression media, photo mechanic, lightroom?
5. Raw file size again. Is there a way to compress the raw files without loss of quality? This may seem like a trivial question but we shoot thousands of images per job, make sometimes a dozen web galleries per project, the retouching of dozens to hundreds of images in layered form get huge and even though drive space is somewhat gone down in price, file sizes have outpaced the drive costs, so anything that makes the file format smaller is greatly welcomed.
6. Learning curve. This is a big one. I like many others have zero free time, my crew less. I know these systems take time to learn, but is Phocus intuitive like Lightroom, is it easy and robust to tether like eos utility? If I give a copy of Phocus to my retoucher can she get up to speed on processing in minutes hours, days? Can I make my color settings in the Hasselblad raw file and it carry on to her machine without reseting everything, like a side car file or a sessions folder and most importantly since 95% of all retouchers want a raw file, even if I ship a processed Tiff, and since 95% of retouchers process in CS3 or 4, does the Hasselblad file work in those programs?
7. Backups. OK, I'm probably too careful, but I don't think I've ever gone out on set without two of almost everything. I have two digital backs, 4 canons two nikons and multiple lenses. I know I can rent H lenses almost anywhere, but lets say I moved to a H3dII or H4d, can I rent one in most studios, most major markets in case mine goes down.
8. Tech service. For small things such as software, I know most good dealers can give me the information, but really tricky stuff, or if equipment goes down, is there a direct to factory line that I can call for troubleshooting and fast repair? Canon has CPS that turns stuff around in a day or two and Leaf of America use to have in Rick A. great turnaround time, (though the camera went in too often), but at least there was a person that actually returned calls, had direct factory access and didn't have to set up a repair case that they forwarded to the factory and then had to wait for the reply then give me the reply.
In other words in I owned an H4d can I call someone and get an answer that moment and if it's hardware related can I get a quick turnaround of repairs, even if I'm willing to pay extra?
9. In camera jpegs. This sounds like a small thing, but I've found in camera jpegs to be invaluable for our workflow. We shoot a lot of images, have fast turnaround times and a properly shot in camera jpeg can be thrown into lightroom for quick adjustments and web galleries saving hours, sometimes days and when you are producing images for fpo at about 1200 pixels across working a jpeg is a lot faster than waiting for previews to build in the raw files and software. Is there a plan for Hasselblad to produce jpegs out of camera?
10. this is the big one. Why would I put down my Phase backs, Canons and go with Hasselblad? What are the clear advantages? In the last few years all of our productions have become larger with higher expectations. The last project we shot was perfect for medium format because it was in studio, we used as much quantity of light we desired, but the catch was this was a project with so much production so many models that even 1 hour of overtime is the costs of a new 1ds3. In prelight, we set up the Phase backs on one computer station, we hooked up the 1ds3's to another station and started lighting.
With the Phase I had a glitch in v4 so we moved to v 3 and it ran ok, but was obviously slower than the Canons. With the Canons I plugged in the usb cord and started shooting and side by side on identical 24" monitors nobody in the room could see that much of a difference in the files and formats and one of the 4 AD's in the room preferred the 1ds3 previews because they were smoother and in his words more film like that the previews in Phase Version 3. (he was right).
OK, I know in post production there's sometimes is a difference and given my way I'd probably shoot with medium format but given the fact I had about twenty seconds to make the decision I went with the 1ds3's.
I'm not pushing Canon, I'm not pushing any brand, but do this............ put yourself in the photographer's shoes for a moment. I can go with a system that is slower, takes a dedicated tech to stand by and tether, requires later jpeg processing from slow to build previews for editing in proprietary software or I can take any I phone savvy assistant and in 30 minutes get him/her up to speed using eos utility.
For this last project we shot over 10,000 frames all tethered to eos utility and had one crash because the cf card was pulled during a buffer. 1 crash!
Can I get this sort of reliability from your system?
11. Film looks. I want this stuff to look like film. I want beautiful skin tones, pull down menus and plug ins like alien skin where I can pick nc100, fuji ultra, or polaroid. I know we're going to work an image in post later on, but I do want my client to see the closest look at time of capture as possible.
Will your software do this, are there third party plug ins?
12. The used car lot. OK, let's be realistic these cameras costs the price of cars and like cars they depreciate quickly. I'm not an e-bay guy, don't see the point of hustling equipment to make an extra $500. When the time comes for me to make a change I want to sell my older cameras quickly, safely, legally and cleanly. With the Canons I just box them up and hand them to my dealer who sells them on consignment at a good price. They usually sell in about two weeks. I keep doing my job which is shooting the dealer does there's which is selling cameras and life goes on.
Why not a clearing house or consignment store for medium format. If I decided today to forego my two Phase backs and the Contax' and go with your system, what is the plan, how do I do this without taking a huge bath?
Why not sell these things like cars, where you have the used camera lot, maybe with a camerafax report on use, repairs, shot count. Why not make it easy for me or others to switch systems without becoming a e-bay power ranger or seller or whatever they are called?
Just a thought.
13. How we work. OK I know you guys know a lot of photographers and everybody shoots and works differently, but how about coming on set for pre production and a casting session of 800 models. How bout coming to the digital techs hotel room to correct, process, sort and rename 2,000 files a day, starting at 8pm?
Then follow the job along with me as we go from client review of images, comp mark ups, retouching notes, retouching galleries all the way to final delivery. You just can't get a grasp on what we do until you pull those twenty hour days with many 6 figures on the line.
Maybe you've done this and if so I stand corrected.
14. Transparency. Nothing sends a customer more loopy than to have a dealer or tech rep say, "uh centerfold, we've seen no centerfold" only to see a firmware release three weeks later saying "the centerfold is now fixed". I've gone this route with the manufacturers tech disavowing centerfold, over heating, overshooting, green previews half black frames, only to get a different response and a fix a year later. Is hasselblad up front about issues, do you get in front of the story or react months later with a partial fix, or even worse never fix that camera, just fix it on the next upgrade? In my view medium format has lost a lot of credibility by not being transparent and getting in front of the issues.
In summary I hope you take this with the best on intentions. I'm not dissing blad or medium format in general I'm just genuinely asking how your system works and plans for the future.
If you ask me what camera I want it's probably something like a big 1ds3, or a digital Pentax 6x7. I want a switch on the back to go from 4:3 to 2:3 to square format and the image crops are reflected in the software. I want real film like looks that are on a pull down menu, I want software that is dead ass simple, dead ass stable, intuitive and I want to be sure I can afford or have backups of everything.
I want to upgrade without haggling over price, I want to know the company will be around when needed, from support to repairs and I don't want to see silly add on warranties unless they are completely useful. I want the numbers up front, including upgrades and I want that GM 60 day return warranty.
In other words I don't want to walk out of the dealer with buyer's remorse.
I don't want to feel like I just bought a $50,000 Ford by the time I get air conditioning and floor mats I want the service and support of a $50,000 Lexus.
Is Hasselblad a Lexus?
Thx.
BC
This was a great post and what I expected when I first came into this forum. I will await the answers as I find the questions real and valuable.
-
without becoming a e-bay power ranger or seller or whatever they are called?
-
I need to catch my breath!
Not for being long. I didn't read it out loud.
It's the content
A lot of food for thought. Thanks BC
Eduardo
For everyone sorry for the long post.
David,
Take this is the best possible way.
I have to admit I'm a little confused about medium format. Leaf has about 4 names for the same back, Phase seems to be going to the Dalsa route, leaving Kodak behind but now that they have Leaf and Mamiya it takes a play book to know what a dl22 is over a Mamiya ZD2, vs a Leaf 5 and Hasselblad seems to have come leaps and bounds since the Imacon days, but there are things I don't really understand about the Hasselblad system.
If I could get all three of the medium format players into an interview room I'd asked a series of questions, but since you are in the room, here goes. Don't worry, I'm not going to mention lcd's and higher iso because I think at this stage we all know that medium format is what it is so the questions I'm asking are exactly what I would need to know if I decided to change camera systems.
1. What is the Hasselblad file format? Are there two, or three and if so why? I hear fff and 3fr thrown around, even dng, but if you shoot to a cf card what is the format and is it the same format as if you tether? Are any of these formats good in 3rd party processors?
2. What is the plan for Hasselblad in regards to sensors? Are you following phase and going to dalsa, are you continuing with Kodak, is there that much of a difference?
3. What computers can run a new Hasselblad camera tethered? I hear about graphic cards updates, but I'm curious because I carry a lot of computers from the latest one piece intel macbook pros, the the 2.16 version, previous generation 24" white imacs and 8 core intel towers.
I use the Imacs in studio, the intel books on a tripod in studio and on location, the tower to process after a shoot, so what are the requirements to run clean, fast and stable with Phocus? Does moving to Hasselblad require brand new computers?
4. What is the raw file size of a Hasselblad file? This may seem trivial but for a lot of us file size is becoming overburdening. Every project at the end of every day we have the raw files on three drives. Once completed, sorted and renamed, we make a master set of files, then test and copy those files
to two backup drives (one going to two of our studios, one going straight to the retoucher). A small job can grow to a terabyte with backups so the smaller in the better.
I know I asked this in a previous question, but if Hasselblad has different file formats how do you view, edit rename and archive the files? If (and once again I'm not clear on what the hasselblad file format is) but do you have to store the hasselblad files in two different formats for safety and compatibility going forward?
With the Phase, Canons and Nikons I do my early sort and renaming in I-view (now Expression media) because it's fast and it allows a manual drag and drop of files. In other words if I shoot two cameras of the same scene I can just drag my selects next to each other rename and they are ready to archive?
Can I do this with Phocus, can the Hasselblad raws work in Expression media, photo mechanic, lightroom?
5. Raw file size again. Is there a way to compress the raw files without loss of quality? This may seem like a trivial question but we shoot thousands of images per job, make sometimes a dozen web galleries per project, the retouching of dozens to hundreds of images in layered form get huge and even though drive space is somewhat gone down in price, file sizes have outpaced the drive costs, so anything that makes the file format smaller is greatly welcomed.
6. Learning curve. This is a big one. I like many others have zero free time, my crew less. I know these systems take time to learn, but is Phocus intuitive like Lightroom, is it easy and robust to tether like eos utility? If I give a copy of Phocus to my retoucher can she get up to speed on processing in minutes hours, days? Can I make my color settings in the Hasselblad raw file and it carry on to her machine without reseting everything, like a side car file or a sessions folder and most importantly since 95% of all retouchers want a raw file, even if I ship a processed Tiff, and since 95% of retouchers process in CS3 or 4, does the Hasselblad file work in those programs?
7. Backups. OK, I'm probably too careful, but I don't think I've ever gone out on set without two of almost everything. I have two digital backs, 4 canons two nikons and multiple lenses. I know I can rent H lenses almost anywhere, but lets say I moved to a H3dII or H4d, can I rent one in most studios, most major markets in case mine goes down.
8. Tech service. For small things such as software, I know most good dealers can give me the information, but really tricky stuff, or if equipment goes down, is there a direct to factory line that I can call for troubleshooting and fast repair? Canon has CPS that turns stuff around in a day or two and Leaf of America use to have in Rick A. great turnaround time, (though the camera went in too often), but at least there was a person that actually returned calls, had direct factory access and didn't have to set up a repair case that they forwarded to the factory and then had to wait for the reply then give me the reply.
In other words in I owned an H4d can I call someone and get an answer that moment and if it's hardware related can I get a quick turnaround of repairs, even if I'm willing to pay extra?
9. In camera jpegs. This sounds like a small thing, but I've found in camera jpegs to be invaluable for our workflow. We shoot a lot of images, have fast turnaround times and a properly shot in camera jpeg can be thrown into lightroom for quick adjustments and web galleries saving hours, sometimes days and when you are producing images for fpo at about 1200 pixels across working a jpeg is a lot faster than waiting for previews to build in the raw files and software. Is there a plan for Hasselblad to produce jpegs out of camera?
10. this is the big one. Why would I put down my Phase backs, Canons and go with Hasselblad? What are the clear advantages? In the last few years all of our productions have become larger with higher expectations. The last project we shot was perfect for medium format because it was in studio, we used as much quantity of light we desired, but the catch was this was a project with so much production so many models that even 1 hour of overtime is the costs of a new 1ds3. In prelight, we set up the Phase backs on one computer station, we hooked up the 1ds3's to another station and started lighting.
With the Phase I had a glitch in v4 so we moved to v 3 and it ran ok, but was obviously slower than the Canons. With the Canons I plugged in the usb cord and started shooting and side by side on identical 24" monitors nobody in the room could see that much of a difference in the files and formats and one of the 4 AD's in the room preferred the 1ds3 previews because they were smoother and in his words more film like that the previews in Phase Version 3. (he was right).
OK, I know in post production there's sometimes is a difference and given my way I'd probably shoot with medium format but given the fact I had about twenty seconds to make the decision I went with the 1ds3's.
I'm not pushing Canon, I'm not pushing any brand, but do this............ put yourself in the photographer's shoes for a moment. I can go with a system that is slower, takes a dedicated tech to stand by and tether, requires later jpeg processing from slow to build previews for editing in proprietary software or I can take any I phone savvy assistant and in 30 minutes get him/her up to speed using eos utility.
For this last project we shot over 10,000 frames all tethered to eos utility and had one crash because the cf card was pulled during a buffer. 1 crash!
Can I get this sort of reliability from your system?
11. Film looks. I want this stuff to look like film. I want beautiful skin tones, pull down menus and plug ins like alien skin where I can pick nc100, fuji ultra, or polaroid. I know we're going to work an image in post later on, but I do want my client to see the closest look at time of capture as possible.
Will your software do this, are there third party plug ins?
12. The used car lot. OK, let's be realistic these cameras costs the price of cars and like cars they depreciate quickly. I'm not an e-bay guy, don't see the point of hustling equipment to make an extra $500. When the time comes for me to make a change I want to sell my older cameras quickly, safely, legally and cleanly. With the Canons I just box them up and hand them to my dealer who sells them on consignment at a good price. They usually sell in about two weeks. I keep doing my job which is shooting the dealer does there's which is selling cameras and life goes on.
Why not a clearing house or consignment store for medium format. If I decided today to forego my two Phase backs and the Contax' and go with your system, what is the plan, how do I do this without taking a huge bath?
Why not sell these things like cars, where you have the used camera lot, maybe with a camerafax report on use, repairs, shot count. Why not make it easy for me or others to switch systems without becoming a e-bay power ranger or seller or whatever they are called?
Just a thought.
13. How we work. OK I know you guys know a lot of photographers and everybody shoots and works differently, but how about coming on set for pre production and a casting session of 800 models. How bout coming to the digital techs hotel room to correct, process, sort and rename 2,000 files a day, starting at 8pm?
Then follow the job along with me as we go from client review of images, comp mark ups, retouching notes, retouching galleries all the way to final delivery. You just can't get a grasp on what we do until you pull those twenty hour days with many 6 figures on the line.
Maybe you've done this and if so I stand corrected.
14. Transparency. Nothing sends a customer more loopy than to have a dealer or tech rep say, "uh centerfold, we've seen no centerfold" only to see a firmware release three weeks later saying "the centerfold is now fixed". I've gone this route with the manufacturers tech disavowing centerfold, over heating, overshooting, green previews half black frames, only to get a different response and a fix a year later. Is hasselblad up front about issues, do you get in front of the story or react months later with a partial fix, or even worse never fix that camera, just fix it on the next upgrade? In my view medium format has lost a lot of credibility by not being transparent and getting in front of the issues.
In summary I hope you take this with the best on intentions. I'm not dissing blad or medium format in general I'm just genuinely asking how your system works and plans for the future.
If you ask me what camera I want it's probably something like a big 1ds3, or a digital Pentax 6x7. I want a switch on the back to go from 4:3 to 2:3 to square format and the image crops are reflected in the software. I want real film like looks that are on a pull down menu, I want software that is dead ass simple, dead ass stable, intuitive and I want to be sure I can afford or have backups of everything.
I want to upgrade without haggling over price, I want to know the company will be around when needed, from support to repairs and I don't want to see silly add on warranties unless they are completely useful. I want the numbers up front, including upgrades and I want that GM 60 day return warranty.
In other words I don't want to walk out of the dealer with buyer's remorse.
I don't want to feel like I just bought a $50,000 Ford by the time I get air conditioning and floor mats I want the service and support of a $50,000 Lexus.
Is Hasselblad a Lexus?
Thx.
BC
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For everyone sorry for the long post.
David,
Take this is the best possible way.
I have to admit I'm a little confused about medium format. Leaf has about 4 names for the same back, Phase seems to be going to the Dalsa route, leaving Kodak behind but now that they have Leaf and Mamiya it takes a play book to know what a dl22 is over a Mamiya ZD2, vs a Leaf 5 and Hasselblad seems to have come leaps and bounds since the Imacon days, but there are things I don't really understand about the Hasselblad system.
If I could get all three of the medium format players into an interview room I'd asked a series of questions, but since you are in the room, here goes. Don't worry, I'm not going to mention lcd's and higher iso because I think at this stage we all know that medium format is what it is so the questions I'm asking are exactly what I would need to know if I decided to change camera systems.
1. What is the Hasselblad file format? Are there two, or three and if so why? I hear fff and 3fr thrown around, even dng, but if you shoot to a cf card what is the format and is it the same format as if you tether? Are any of these formats good in 3rd party processors?
2...
...
I want to upgrade without haggling over price, I want to know the company will be around when needed, from support to repairs and I don't want to see silly add on warranties unless they are completely useful. I want the numbers up front, including upgrades and I want that GM 60 day return warranty.
In other words I don't want to walk out of the dealer with buyer's remorse.
I don't want to feel like I just bought a $50,000 Ford by the time I get air conditioning and floor mats I want the service and support of a $50,000 Lexus.
Is Hasselblad a Lexus?
Thx.
BC
That is by far the best questions I have seen on this forum and I hope we will have ALL the answer soon. I like the 60 days return warranty...
Can you imagine if we could return the product if the product doesn't perform as advertised !!!
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David, if you've captured to "small embedded preview" from the 3fr file and only have the fff file left, can you "reprocess" it to embed a large preview? I have 10,000+ images captured on my MacBook with the small preview setting which I'd really like to be able to sort in Phocus on my MacPro- to do that, I really need to see if the image is sharp. It isn't a deal-breaker to zoom up to 25%, but would be nice to batch process overnight to fix it instead.
Capturing with large embedded preview is fine for new stuff, can you reprocess 3fr's to get large previews?
Cheers, Hywel.
To come back to your question...
In theory it is possible, but it would also involve rewriting every byte of the RAW data, so that we are a bit nervous about. We could ask customers to make a backup first but in your situation, backing up 10,000+ images is a big ask.
Anyway, it is on the table and we shall see what we come up with.
David
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To come back to your question...
In theory it is possible, but it would also involve rewriting every byte of the RAW data, so that we are a bit nervous about. We could ask customers to make a backup first but in your situation, backing up 10,000+ images is a big ask.
Anyway, it is on the table and we shall see what we come up with.
David
Ummm, it isn't such a big ask- they are all backed up multiple times on several hard drives and offsite already Those first 10,000 images cost more than the camera in location/model/crew fees, so a robust backup strategy is already in place
I find that the critical thing in handling relatively large data volumes is what has to be done manually- backing up 6 TB of data isn't a chore, if it is all happening automatically. I can go work on something else on another computer and it can all finish while I'm asleep.
The killer is things that slow one down when interacting with the data- in this case, not being able to see a sharp preview instantly when going through the images to rate them. Anything which saves one two mouse clicks or a five second wait really makes a difference when dealing with large numbers of images to be processed.
It isn't a deal-breaker- it was only a couple of weeks location shoots, and I'm probably a third of the way through processing them anyway. I'll capture all future stuff with large embedded previews and learn my lesson.
Cheers, Hywel.
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David,
Take this is the best possible way.
I have to admit I'm a little confused about medium format. Leaf has about 4 names for the same back, Phase seems to be going to the Dalsa route, leaving Kodak behind but now that they have Leaf and Mamiya it takes a play book to know what a dl22 is over a Mamiya ZD2, vs a Leaf 5 and Hasselblad seems to have come leaps and bounds since the Imacon days, but there are things I don't really understand about the Hasselblad system.
No problem, I don't think you have been out of line in any of your uber-long post! I can't speak for Leaf and Phase and would not be professional to do so, so we shall leave that one there.
If there are things you don't understand then we will solve them as I continue.
If I could get all three of the medium format players into an interview room I'd asked a series of questions, but since you are in the room, here goes. Don't worry, I'm not going to mention lcd's and higher iso because I think at this stage we all know that medium format is what it is so the questions I'm asking are exactly what I would need to know if I decided to change camera systems.
The H4D60 has a double resolution LCD screen so you can mention that. But yes, as for ISO, while this has improved you are not going to see D3X busting 24,600 levels anytime soon. Unless CMOS moves on enough for MF use. However, the H3D31 and I guess that Phase equivalent is miles ahead of the older 22MP sensors.
1. What is the Hasselblad file format? Are there two, or three and if so why? I hear fff and 3fr thrown around, even dng, but if you shoot to a cf card what is the format and is it the same format as if you tether? Are any of these formats good in 3rd party processors?
DNG began with the first ever H2D a long time ago but we quickly stopped using DNG as it slowed the camera down too much when going beyond 22MP. The DNG format as such requires certain parameters to 'close it' and it simply is not economical IF you want a decent burst rate.
So in answer to your question...
Shoot a file to a CF card = 3FR file format
Shoot direct to Phocus = 3F format.
There is little difference in the two, except that when the 3FR file is imported (very similar process to Lightroom, Capture One, Aperture etc etc) a larger more useful (see below) JPEG is created and embedded in the 3F file. As is all your IPTC Meta Data, camera data and file history. In one file, no .xml side car files and cross compatible between Mac and PC and multiple computers. Seems we were the first company to figure out how very useful this is to photographers.
2. What is the plan for Hasselblad in regards to sensors? Are you following phase and going to dalsa, are you continuing with Kodak, is there that much of a difference?
We choose the sensors that fit our requirements. If that is Kodak or Dalsa, so be it. They both have different properties.
3. What computers can run a new Hasselblad camera tethered? I hear about graphic cards updates, but I'm curious because I carry a lot of computers from the latest one piece intel macbook pros, the the 2.16 version, previous generation 24" white imacs and 8 core intel towers. I use the Imacs in studio, the intel books on a tripod in studio and on location, the tower to process after a shoot, so what are the requirements to run clean, fast and stable with Phocus? Does moving to Hasselblad require brand new computers?
Must be Intel Based with Leopard on Mac. Snow Leopard will give a slight increase in performance. Why? We use Apple based OpenGL/Core Image commands to access the processor on the graphics cards to give real time feedback on adjustments. ie at 100% if you manipulate any of the controls the image does not have to pixelate/redraw each time.
Also we gain performance as we can use computer processor and graphics processor simultaneously. This is the way Pshop is going and as Aperture always has done.
Spec-wise you benefit from a 512MB graphic card if you are using 50MP and up but a 216MB will suffice for lower. RAM, I would recommend 4GB. Any MAc produced within the last 12-24 months should be ok. 24" white iMacs I would steer clear of. 8 core Intel towers, yes please although Apple did fit really puny graphics cards in the 1st generation. Graphics cards do not cost the earth to replace. $200-$300 would give you nice performance.
New iMac, no problem. 27" model would be nice I reckon.
PC Can be XP or Vista, 32 or 64 Bit (64 recommended) and Windows 7 is looking promising. Graphic card situation applies as well. 512MB minimum on PC.
4. What is the raw file size of a Hasselblad file? This may seem trivial but for a lot of us file size is becoming overburdening. Every project at the end of every day we have the raw files on three drives. Once completed, sorted and renamed, we make a master set of files, then test and copy those files
to two backup drives (one going to two of our studios, one going straight to the retoucher). A small job can grow to a terabyte with backups so the smaller in the better.
31MP = 50MB Approx
39MP = 60MB Approx
50MP = 90MB Approx
Approx as the file is compressed. Not image compression, but a lossless data compression. You could add 5MB max to those above values.
....Continued on next pane - I have run out of quote block allocation!
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I know I asked this in a previous question, but if Hasselblad has different file formats how do you view, edit rename and archive the files? If (and once again I'm not clear on what the hasselblad file format is) but do you have to store the hasselblad files in two different formats for safety and compatibility going forward?
Really the 3FR has a small life, once you have imported off the CF card there is no need to keep it. You can edit down files on a CF without having to transfer them if you want to do a quick select. There is a simple color rating system which can do this and filter results.
Renaming can be done as a batch process, via an import with your own naming convention template, or by simply clicking on the image name title to rename one image. Lots of options to suit different needs.
With the Phase, Canons and Nikons I do my early sort and renaming in I-view (now Expression media) because it's fast and it allows a manual drag and drop of files. In other words if I shoot two cameras of the same scene I can just drag my selects next to each other rename and they are ready to archive?
Forgive me, as I might not fully understand your question. But if you have two folders on your computer of a continued shoot, you could compile them together as a Quick Collection (either drag and drop to a special folder or click the image and hit CMD- and then you could rename them from the QC folder, or copy them or move them elsewhere.
Can I do this with Phocus, can the Hasselblad raws work in Expression media, photo mechanic, lightroom?
Boy, you must be the first person to ask me about Expression media! I believe Microsoft did do extensive testing with 3F files but I couldn't be 100% sure of their compatibility. I just googled it and am I right in thinking it is no longer available? They do not mention the 'Media' package anymore???
5. Raw file size again. Is there a way to compress the raw files without loss of quality? This may seem like a trivial question but we shoot thousands of images per job, make sometimes a dozen web galleries per project, the retouching of dozens to hundreds of images in layered form get huge and even though drive space is somewhat gone down in price, file sizes have outpaced the drive costs, so anything that makes the file format smaller is greatly welcomed.
The Raw files are compressed by default, hence the varying size. You could .zip them additionally.
6. Learning curve. This is a big one. I like many others have zero free time, my crew less. I know these systems take time to learn, but is Phocus intuitive like Lightroom, is it easy and robust to tether like eos utility? If I give a copy of Phocus to my retoucher can she get up to speed on processing in minutes hours, days? Can I make my color settings in the Hasselblad raw file and it carry on to her machine without reseting everything, like a side car file or a sessions folder and most importantly since 95% of all retouchers want a raw file, even if I ship a processed Tiff, and since 95% of retouchers process in CS3 or 4, does the Hasselblad file work in those programs?
zero free time
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I checked your stats and your combined personalities have clocked up more than 1000 posts, averaging at least two per day. If you can manage that, you can manage a few hours on developing your software skills. Probably a better ROI of time, no?
Yes, I beleive it is intuituve. But you knew I would say that right?
In justification part of my job is Phocus training. The comment I normally receive it 'Oh it's just like Lightroom'. So I hope that helps. The layout is similar, so there is no suprises where stuff is.
Tethering is definitely a strength and there is a great deal or remote camera control. Not so much use to you, but at least the tech can see what settings you have on the camera at all times, incase you accidentally changed ISO to the wrong value, for example.
Yes, any setting you make on your machine is embedded in the file, so if you send it to your retoucher, they will see what you see. This is automatic, you do not need to make a command, or package any files with the 3F file. It is also a non-destructive process of course, so if you throw a tantrum and decide to start again, there is no love lost.
The 3FR file is compatible with Lightroom, V2 onward and the version of ACR that arrived with CS4. 3F support is coming soon. This was Adobe's decision not ours, but we have requested they add 3F support too. The rational being is that they believed that users wanting the 'Lightroom/ACR' route would bypass Phocus altogether, therefore only having 3FR files.
You can also synchronise your machines with the same workspace in Phocus, same naming conventions, same layouts... etc etc. It can all be identical machine to machine. Phocus 2.0 adds this functionality.
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7. Backups. OK, I'm probably too careful, but I don't think I've ever gone out on set without two of almost everything. I have two digital backs, 4 canons two nikons and multiple lenses. I know I can rent H lenses almost anywhere, but lets say I moved to a H3dII or H4d, can I rent one in most studios, most major markets in case mine goes down.
Depends what you consider major markets, but there are multiple outlets in Paris / London / Tokyo for example. I can't speak for the USA as I spend little time there. Maybe one of my colleagues will throw me a lifeline here.
8. Tech service. For small things such as software, I know most good dealers can give me the information, but really tricky stuff, or if equipment goes down, is there a direct to factory line that I can call for troubleshooting and fast repair? Canon has CPS that turns stuff around in a day or two and Leaf of America use to have in Rick A. great turnaround time, (though the camera went in too often), but at least there was a person that actually returned calls, had direct factory access and didn't have to set up a repair case that they forwarded to the factory and then had to wait for the reply then give me the reply.
In other words in I owned an H4d can I call someone and get an answer that moment and if it's hardware related can I get a quick turnaround of repairs, even if I'm willing to pay extra?
Mostly you can deal with your dealer or in your case speak to New Jersey. Again maybe one of my colleagues will help!
There is the H camera care plan... This answers pretty much all your questions...
http://www.hasselblad.com/service--support...-care-plan.aspx (http://www.hasselblad.com/service--support/the-hasselblad-camera-care-plan.aspx)
9. In camera jpegs. This sounds like a small thing, but I've found in camera jpegs to be invaluable for our workflow. We shoot a lot of images, have fast turnaround times and a properly shot in camera jpeg can be thrown into lightroom for quick adjustments and web galleries saving hours, sometimes days and when you are producing images for fpo at about 1200 pixels across working a jpeg is a lot faster than waiting for previews to build in the raw files and software. Is there a plan for Hasselblad to produce jpegs out of camera?
No you cannot make in-camera JPEGS. To do this would most likely require ASIC processors. If you want me to be boring I discuss the advantages and disadvantages of FPGA over ASIC but most likely not.
As an alternative you can generate JPEG files about 1200 pixels across near instantaneously from the 3F file. They require no processing as they were already created on Import. They are cropped and color balanced to your settings on the RAW file so accurately represent the final image, albeit before post.
10. this is the big one. Why would I put down my Phase backs, Canons and go with Hasselblad? What are the clear advantages? In the last few years all of our productions have become larger with higher expectations. The last project we shot was perfect for medium format because it was in studio, we used as much quantity of light we desired, but the catch was this was a project with so much production so many models that even 1 hour of overtime is the costs of a new 1ds3. In prelight, we set up the Phase backs on one computer station, we hooked up the 1ds3's to another station and started lighting.
With the Phase I had a glitch in v4 so we moved to v 3 and it ran ok, but was obviously slower than the Canons. With the Canons I plugged in the usb cord and started shooting and side by side on identical 24" monitors nobody in the room could see that much of a difference in the files and formats and one of the 4 AD's in the room preferred the 1ds3 previews because they were smoother and in his words more film like that the previews in Phase Version 3. (he was right).
I wouldn't expect you to if you didn't feel there is something 'missing' from your current equipment. However, your leading questions lead me to think there might be. If you can't see a difference between the files, then the conversation stops here doesn't it? A quick clear advantage list...
1. Robust tethering
2. Integrated solution, so no finger pointing to the other guy if things go wrong... but they NEVER do!!!
3. Single battery, so no two charger, two battery, two battery level syndrome.
4. Things you have already pointed out, like..
- Complete lens line up
- Internal AF drives, not body driven AF (less accurate, weak motor in the body, not Canon style USM motors)
- Leaf shutters, Flash sync any speed
- Lens corrections
- HTS tilt shift (not for you though maybe)
Shall I add "3D look" as well?
OK, I know in post production there's sometimes is a difference and given my way I'd probably shoot with medium format but given the fact I had about twenty seconds to make the decision I went with the 1ds3's.
I'm not pushing Canon, I'm not pushing any brand, but do this............ put yourself in the photographer's shoes for a moment. I can go with a system that is slower, takes a dedicated tech to stand by and tether, requires later jpeg processing from slow to build previews for editing in proprietary software or I can take any I phone savvy assistant and in 30 minutes get him/her up to speed using eos utility.
For this last project we shot over 10,000 frames all tethered to eos utility and had one crash because the cf card was pulled during a buffer. 1 crash!
Can I get this sort of reliability from your system?
Maybe this is best answered by other users with more credibility than me? I don't mean to discredit myself, but I would like the customers to speak on this one as they are on the front line, I am not.
11. Film looks. I want this stuff to look like film. I want beautiful skin tones, pull down menus and plug ins like alien skin where I can pick nc100, fuji ultra, or polaroid. I know we're going to work an image in post later on, but I do want my client to see the closest look at time of capture as possible. Will your software do this, are there third party plug ins?
Use film? ;-)
You can easily create different looks in the software and save them as presets. These can be applied in one click to a single image or to a batch of images. Remembering once again this is non-destructive.
This could also be applied on import from CF card. So if you have defined a look early on in the day/shoot, this can be saved as a preset and applied subsequently to any other import from a CF Card. Obviously you can apply any look to an image as it is captured tethered.
12. The used car lot. OK, let's be realistic these cameras costs the price of cars and like cars they depreciate quickly. I'm not an e-bay guy, don't see the point of hustling equipment to make an extra $500. When the time comes for me to make a change I want to sell my older cameras quickly, safely, legally and cleanly. With the Canons I just box them up and hand them to my dealer who sells them on consignment at a good price. They usually sell in about two weeks. I keep doing my job which is shooting the dealer does there's which is selling cameras and life goes on.
Why not a clearing house or consignment store for medium format. If I decided today to forego my two Phase backs and the Contax' and go with your system, what is the plan, how do I do this without taking a huge bath?
Why not sell these things like cars, where you have the used camera lot, maybe with a camerafax report on use, repairs, shot count. Why not make it easy for me or others to switch systems without becoming a e-bay power ranger or seller or whatever they are called?
Just a thought.
There is an upgrade program for existing H users and non users, with very little, if none at all difference in pricing between the two. Many of our dealers take in the old stock as well to sell on consignment.
13. How we work. OK I know you guys know a lot of photographers and everybody shoots and works differently, but how about coming on set for pre production and a casting session of 800 models. How bout coming to the digital techs hotel room to correct, process, sort and rename 2,000 files a day, starting at 8pm?
Then follow the job along with me as we go from client review of images, comp mark ups, retouching notes, retouching galleries all the way to final delivery. You just can't get a grasp on what we do until you pull those twenty hour days with many 6 figures on the line.
Maybe you've done this and if so I stand corrected.
I have actually done this once or twice for my own 'Professional Development'. Probably why I have no desire to be a photographer! Joking aside this was also an exercise set by the MD of Hasselblad UK for the sales employees. Booked a studio, models, casting session, grumpy stylist, the works. Was a very valuable exercise. If I ever come to NYC again, I offer my services to you... Ill give you a discount on my tech rate.
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14. Transparency. Nothing sends a customer more loopy than to have a dealer or tech rep say, "uh centerfold, we've seen no centerfold" only to see a firmware release three weeks later saying "the centerfold is now fixed". I've gone this route with the manufacturers tech disavowing centerfold, over heating, overshooting, green previews half black frames, only to get a different response and a fix a year later. Is hasselblad up front about issues, do you get in front of the story or react months later with a partial fix, or even worse never fix that camera, just fix it on the next upgrade? In my view medium format has lost a lot of credibility by not being transparent and getting in front of the issues.
Well for what it is worth we never really had the centrefold issue. There, got that one in. Not sure how to answer this one really, Ill admit that the H2D was a bit of a lemon on first release. Luckily it was mostly firmware related and existing H2D's function very nicely now - one of the benefits of having firmware that can be uploaded by you locally - no need for service centres. We have certainly admitted our errors in the past, maybe not all? Again, I am sure customers will step in here if I am out of line.
In summary I hope you take this with the best on intentions. I'm not dissing blad or medium format in general I'm just genuinely asking how your system works and plans for the future.
No problem.
If you ask me what camera I want it's probably something like a big 1ds3, or a digital Pentax 6x7. I want a switch on the back to go from 4:3 to 2:3 to square format and the image crops are reflected in the software. I want real film like looks that are on a pull down menu, I want software that is dead ass simple, dead ass stable, intuitive and I want to be sure I can afford or have backups of everything.
I want to upgrade without haggling over price, I want to know the company will be around when needed, from support to repairs and I don't want to see silly add on warranties unless they are completely useful. I want the numbers up front, including upgrades and I want that GM 60 day return warranty.
I think we can do all of that.... maybe not the GM warranty part though, but I hope the Camera Care Plan was interesting. But don't take my word for it, try one out.
In other words I don't want to walk out of the dealer with buyer's remorse.
I don't want to feel like I just bought a $50,000 Ford by the time I get air conditioning and floor mats I want the service and support of a $50,000 Lexus.
Is Hasselblad a Lexus?
I have opted out of the 'Car Analogy Program' but ill go with Range Rover just this once.
Best,
David
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That concludes my post. Sorry for the multiple panes, but I had a limit of quote boxes apparently.
I am off for a lie down!
David
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Wow, I actually feel smarter after reading something in here. Maybe this post and answer will get this place back on track.
I want to thank both of you for your question and answers. Appreciated.
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Ill admit that the H2D was a bit of a lemon on first release.
David
Will the delay in the release of the HD4 result in a lemon-free camera on first release?
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bcooter, David Grover- thanks a lot. This was very valuable.
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Excellent David!
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Will the delay in the release of the HD4 result in a lemon-free camera on first release?
How has the Hd4 been delayed? I thought it was coming out first of the year? Has that changed?
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How has the Hd4 been delayed? I thought it was coming out first of the year? Has that changed?
It is coming out January. Dick was referring to the H3DII-60 which we decided to simply issue as an H4D later on to save having two 60MP versions in the market place.
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Use film? ;-)
You can easily create different looks in the software and save them as presets. These can be applied in one click to a single image or to a batch of images. Remembering once again this is non-destructive.
This could also be applied on import from CF card. So if you have defined a look early on in the day/shoot, this can be saved as a preset and applied subsequently to any other import from a CF Card. Obviously you can apply any look to an image as it is captured tethered.
I'll just step in here and say that this particular aspect of Phocus & Hasselblad workflow works really well for me. I like it a lot. Generally speaking, I'm my own art director on shoots and don't have clients breathing down my neck evaluating the shots, but what I do have is models who are very keen to see how everything looks on screen. The ability to apply our "regular" look on import from CF means that the shots are a much closer approximation of the final versions (especially in terms of really lush colours with our "signature look") than we could ever get out of Canons we previously worked with.
When we reviewed sets over dinner every evening it was the 'blad shots that everyone went "ooooooooh!" over- not the 5D Mk2 shots. Better impact right off the card, without making any decision that can't be instantly reversed, non-destructively, and batch applied at a later stage. This particular feature works really well for me.
Cheers, Hywel.
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How has the Hd4 been delayed? I thought it was coming out first of the year? Has that changed?
The "60" has been delayed...
I think 15/1/2010 is the current anticipated release date of the H4D-60, but they were going to release the H3D11-60 in October I think, but that, of course was a different model.
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this thread seems to be getting some attention, so i have a phocus question about export.
specifically, how does one set the export destination simply?
when i choose export, i get the root directory and have to sort through the tree to get anywhere.
my workflow is to store processed images within a subfolder with the shoot date name, that also contains the imported images.
what would be handy is a way to set the export destination the same way one sets the capture destination (by selection from the browser, where one can see the tree and what subfolder is open). a useful one line choice would be " same as capture destination" presumably in a "preview" subdirectory.
am i missing something simple?
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this thread seems to be getting some attention, so i have a phocus question about export.
specifically, how does one set the export destination simply?
when i choose export, i get the root directory and have to sort through the tree to get anywhere.
my workflow is to store processed images within a subfolder with the shoot date name, that also contains the imported images.
what would be handy is a way to set the export destination the same way one sets the capture destination (by selection from the browser, where one can see the tree and what subfolder is open). a useful one line choice would be " same as capture destination" presumably in a "preview" subdirectory.
am i missing something simple?
There is no such a shortcut like for the capture destination, and it would save a few seconds, I agree.
But you'll have to list through directories from the root folder only once. The next time you export something the phocus opens the same folder unless the folder was deleted.
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14. Transparency. Nothing sends a customer more loopy than to have a dealer or tech rep say, "uh centerfold, we've seen no centerfold" only to see a firmware release three weeks later saying "the centerfold is now fixed".
I love that one too. As in, "Mirror slap on the H1? No way. What mirror slap?", and then, the next camera and firmware comes out, and quietly, there's a Custom Function introduced for "Mirror Delay".
Why fix a non-existent problem?
And this is not a Hasselblad-bash. I am an Equal Opportunity Basher. I own Phase backs too, and my list is long. So enough with the Hasselblad-bash remarks. But distrust? Yeah, I got it.
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I love that one too. As in, "Mirror slap on the H1? No way. What mirror slap?", and then, the next camera and firmware comes out, and quietly, there's a Custom Function introduced for "Mirror Delay".
Why fix a non-existent problem?
Gwyneth,
Think of Mirror Slap not as a problem but as a FEATURE...
Mirror Delay is a way to build Product Feature Anticipation to a fever pitch.
Simply Brilliant!
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The Million Dollar Question, also known as Poulsen's Dilemma, is: Does it make them invest further in Hasselblad, or does it make them bolt to Nikon/Canon?
Gwyneth,
Hasselblad is still only up the The Sixty Four Thousand Dollar Question, but in time if they get lucky with Phone-A-Friend and 50/50 they may get the price of their cameras up to The Million Dollar Question. Don't expect them to ever use the Ask-the-Audience Lifeline though... What could be learned from that?
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These forums tend to be very Phase biased so you might be forgiven for thinking that Hasselblad does not sell any cameras.. I could point you at a forum where it appears that Sinar completely dominates the market if you like
Nick, it would be very helpful for me if you could point me at this Sinar forum
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Nick, it would be very helpful for me if you could point me at this Sinar forum
Here you go:
http://www.openphotographyforums.com/forum...isplay.php?f=16 (http://www.openphotographyforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=16)
Nick-T
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I love that one too. As in, "Mirror slap on the H1? No way. What mirror slap?", and then, the next camera and firmware comes out, and quietly, there's a Custom Function introduced for "Mirror Delay".
George
Mirror slap was not in fact considered an issue. The vibration had been measured and compared to other cameras way back when, (it produces less slap/vibration than the Contax for example) so it was not thought to be an issue. Remember the guys building the cameras are not photographers first and foremost.
I had never really noticed the mirror slap but then I'm not hand holding as much as some. I first heard about the issue from Mark Tucker who wrote great essays on the subject (he writes well), I took the complaints to the product manager for H system and asked if they could enable a delay feature which they did and which they should be commended for I think.
Nick-T
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Here you go:
http://www.openphotographyforums.com/forum...isplay.php?f=16 (http://www.openphotographyforums.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=16)
Thanks for the link. It seems that Sinar dominates not because there are so many Sinar users, but because there is no one else Anyway, I registered and will see what useful information I can find there.
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There is no such a shortcut like for the capture destination, and it would save a few seconds, I agree.
But you'll have to list through directories from the root folder only once. The next time you export something the phocus opens the same folder unless the folder was deleted.
Also don't forget in any OSX app you have the 'recent places' sections in the pull down menu which will more than likely show you your capture destination.
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George
Mirror slap was not in fact considered an issue. The vibration had been measured and compared to other cameras way back when, (it produces less slap/vibration than the Contax for example) so it was not thought to be an issue. Remember the guys building the cameras are not photographers first and foremost.
I had never really noticed the mirror slap but then I'm not hand holding as much as some. I first heard about the issue from Mark Tucker who wrote great essays on the subject (he writes well), I took the complaints to the product manager for H system and asked if they could enable a delay feature which they did and which they should be commended for I think.
Nick-T
I don't know how they measure mirror vibration at Hasselblad. All I know is that it feels more prominent than on a Contax in your hands. If you really try to feel what is happening - and where - the action from the Contax seems to be centered in the body, slightly towards the hand grip. And the action feels vertical and muffled by the camera body. On the H2, it feels like the action is coming into play from the front of the camera/lens and it has a sideways feel to it. As if someone pushed down on the left side of the lens on the front of your camera.
Perhaps the vibration measurement in Hasselblad's testing did show the H2 producing less vibration than the Contax, I believe you. But that brings into play how it is measured. In the hand, the Contax feels somewhere in the core of the body, vertical action, muffled. On the H2, it's more towards the front of the camera or lens and the action feels like a yank to the left.
The delay on the H2 does help, but no matter how the vibration is measured, the mirror action of the Contax - in the hand - will have less effect on the sharpness of the image.
Steve Hendrix
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I don't know how they measure mirror vibration at Hasselblad. All I know is that it feels more prominent than on a Contax in your hands. If you really try to feel what is happening - and where - the action from the Contax seems to be centered in the body, slightly towards the hand grip.
Every time somebody says the H2 has mirror slap someone else says, "I routinely shoot my H2 at 1/4 of a second and everything is sharp".
Maybe, maybe not but I've shot a billion frames with the contax, especially using continuous light and it's much smoother than any camera I use including the Canons and Nikons.
Now I'll be the first to admit I'm not always that overly concerned with uber over sharp, see every pore from 6 blocks away photography and I'll admit that I've only shot an H series camera twice for projects, but the difference in the way it feels as far as mirror slap or vibration or whatever it's called feels like it's double that on the H series, or half that on the contax.
Now the downside is the contax has a small view through the prism (though quite large in a waist level finder) and the view in a H series is much larger (though in my experience the H series prism seems to bend the image which is not exactly in relation to the final image, which kind of breaks my brain.
I've pretty much placed the Contax as a specialty camera, rather than a 2000 frame a day lifestyle advertising camera. It will do 2000 frames a day, but you'll work hard at it compared to a dslr, less hard than most medium format cameras because it does have a 90 degree grip.
What I do love about the contax is the ability to put on a lot of different glass.
This image is with the old Boris Tilt shift lens, at 1/30th of a second and it's sharp where I want it to be, smooth and soft where I want that.
[attachment=17787:copyrigh...new_york.jpg]
This image also with the Hareblei 45mm Tilt Shift at 1/30th using modeling lights and an old Aptus 22.
[attachment=17790:copyrigh..._york_lk.jpg]
This second image is shot with the Contax 80mm Zeiss with flash and obviously it's pin point sharp, so the Contax does have a lot of versatility when it comes to glass.
[attachment=17788:copyrigh...arcelona.jpg]
I even have an adapter to use pentax 6x7 lenses which also have their own look and less bite than the standard Ziess lenses.
[attachment=17789:copyrigh...rk_divas.jpg]
JR
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I don't know how they measure mirror vibration at Hasselblad. All I know is that it feels more prominent than on a Contax in your hands. If you really try to feel what is happening - and where - the action from the Contax seems to be centered in the body, slightly towards the hand grip. And the action feels vertical and muffled by the camera body. On the H2, it feels like the action is coming into play from the front of the camera/lens and it has a sideways feel to it. As if someone pushed down on the left side of the lens on the front of your camera.
Perhaps the vibration measurement in Hasselblad's testing did show the H2 producing less vibration than the Contax, I believe you. But that brings into play how it is measured. In the hand, the Contax feels somewhere in the core of the body, vertical action, muffled. On the H2, it's more towards the front of the camera or lens and the action feels like a yank to the left.
The delay on the H2 does help, but no matter how the vibration is measured, the mirror action of the Contax - in the hand - will have less effect on the sharpness of the image.
Steve Hendrix
I might be alone here but it disturbs me when an employee of another company (whether Hasselblad, Phase, Leica, Contax, etc) comments on a thread about another companies equipment. I can understand defending your own equipment but I don't respect piling on opinions or impressions of an obvious competitor. It just doesn't strike me as being professional and it certainly can't be read as a neutral statement. Just my opinion.
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Regarding the H system, is there an on-camera flash unit that fully talks to the H body? In the old days, there was that Hasselblad flash that hooked up to the 203FE body so well. It looked kinda like that Quantum Q Flash, in way.
When I look on this page:
http://www.hasselbladusa.com/products/lens...ccessories.aspx (http://www.hasselbladusa.com/products/lenses-and-accessories/h-system-accessories.aspx)
I don't see a flash unit. Could you use the old unit? Are there downsides to it? (And please, no recommendations to use the professional pop-up flash in the viewfinder). Thanks.
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I might be alone here but it disturbs me when an employee of another company (whether Hasselblad, Phase, Leica, Contax, etc) comments on a thread about another companies equipment. I can understand defending your own equipment but I don't respect piling on opinions or impressions of an obvious competitor. It just doesn't strike me as being professional and it certainly can't be read as a neutral statement. Just my opinion.
I certainly understand your feelings about this G.
I share the same reticence and as a result, keep that very much to a minimum and also try to restrict anything I say to quantifiable information.
With me, it's a little weird because I've sold all of the major brands throughout my career.
The other thing to keep in mind is that - in general - most of the dealers and reps, etc, know each other very well, have a high degree of respect for each other, and personally wish each other the best (or something close to that).
And, honestly, I hope that if I or any other member of our team at Capture Integration ever glosses over an issue, or states something which in actual application is not the case, that someone points it out to us. The most important thing that can occur from our participation in forums like these, is that the end users themselves have access to the most accurate information regarding the products they might purchase or already own.
In many cases, we are particularly credible, sometimes more so than prospective end users because of our comparative experience with a broad array of similar products, which takes into account legacy and current performance. When it comes to checking each other, we are often optimally positioned to do just that.
Sorry, but when I read that a Hasselblad H2 has less mirror vibration than a Contax 645 AF, I feel obligated to mention my - very valid, IMO - experience with both cameras.
We don't sell Contax either...
Steve Hendrix
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I might be alone here but it disturbs me when an employee of another company (whether Hasselblad, Phase, Leica, Contax, etc) comments on a thread about another companies equipment. I can understand defending your own equipment but I don't respect piling on opinions or impressions of an obvious competitor. It just doesn't strike me as being professional and it certainly can't be read as a neutral statement. Just my opinion.
The neutrality does not depend on the employer, but on the individual in question. I trust Steve to say the truth, and not something else. Besides, didn't Steve used to work for Hasselblad, or a dealer (PPR), so he really ought to have some experience with it?
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We don't sell Contax
That bites!
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That bites!
Tell me about it!
Steve Hendrix
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Perhaps the vibration measurement in Hasselblad's testing did show the H2 producing less vibration than the Contax, I believe you. But that brings into play how it is measured. In the hand, the Contax feels somewhere in the core of the body, vertical action, muffled. On the H2, it's more towards the front of the camera or lens and the action feels like a yank to the left.
Steve Hendrix
The only vibration that counts is what happens during the exposure - if you get vibration after the exposure (when the mirror comes down), it does not blur the image.
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Tell me about it!
I know... now you have to sell Mamiyas
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Tell me about it!
Steve Hendrix
There is probably not a single specialty camera dealer who does not know the H system well, regardless of the brand of back they sell.
Steve obviously does because he's sold them all and though he now writes like a lawyer (insert one of those silly smiley faced things), I know from experience he won't push something on a customer that
won't work for them.
He handed me a hasselblad 39 when it was still in release and I shot some frames, like the look of the file but explained what did and didn't work for me and he left it at that.
He's not over the top selling anything.
BC
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The only vibration that counts is what happens during the exposure - if you get vibration after the exposure (when the mirror comes down), it does not blur the image.
True, but the fact there are increments indicates there is residual affect. Perhaps not? Then why have increments?
Steve Hendrix
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There is probably not a single specialty camera dealer who does not know the H system well, regardless of the brand of back they sell.
Steve obviously does because he's sold them all and though he now writes like a lawyer (insert one of those silly smiley faced things), I know from experience he won't push something on a customer that
won't work for them.
He handed me a hasselblad 39 when it was still in release and I shot some frames, like the look of the file but explained what did and didn't work for me and he left it at that.
He's not over the top selling anything.
BC
I'm nothing if not diplomatic. My curse is being able to see the virtues of competing arguments. I often have a hard time disagreeing with someone after they've detailed their argument to me (though it's not impossible for me to do).
Steve Hendrix
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True, but the fact there are increments indicates there is residual affect. Perhaps not? Then why have increments?
Steve Hendrix
The 'vibration' was measured to dissipate after 40ms, hence the minimum being 50ms. The reason that there are increments are the unknown variable(s) attached to the camera.
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The only vibration that counts is what happens during the exposure - if you get vibration after the exposure (when the mirror comes down), it does not blur the image.
Have you tested this phenomenon personally, both handheld and tripod mounted? I have. So what were your findings?
My opinion now is that the H2 and H1 are tripod-only, mirror-up cameras, or, with-studio-strobe cameras, to kill this "lunging effect" from the body.
I have tests that show camera shake even on a giant Bogen tripod with that huge RRS Ballhead, shot with tungsten light, under controlled conditions. Maybe it's just my particular bod(ies), but others have reported this as well. It doesn't take a Lab Coat to feel a camera body lunging in your hands; only a working photographer who shoots regularly.
Nick's suggestion to introduce the mirror delay has certainly eased the problem, but it introduces new doubt when shooting people, when looking for fleeting facial expressions. You set it too high, and you're creeping uncomfortably close to Mamiya645 performance.
And again, I ain't "bashing" anybody. I'm just calling them as I see them. I'd complain about Canon or Nikon if it did the same thing, (but it doesn't). My advice: If you own an H, you ought to also own a solid tripod, and learn how to set up the User Button to raise the mirror. What was infuriating to me was: I realized I'd just laid out tens of thousands of dollars for a "medium format solution" that REQUIRED me shooting with a tripod. That's fine, if you're a studio photographer, but grim news if you're a location guy. I'd, in effect, spent big money on a view camera. Not good.
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Regarding the H system, is there an on-camera flash unit that fully talks to the H body? In the old days, there was that Hasselblad flash that hooked up to the 203FE body so well. It looked kinda like that Quantum Q Flash, in way.
When I look on this page:
http://www.hasselbladusa.com/products/lens...ccessories.aspx (http://www.hasselbladusa.com/products/lenses-and-accessories/h-system-accessories.aspx)
I don't see a flash unit. Could you use the old unit? Are there downsides to it? (And please, no recommendations to use the professional pop-up flash in the viewfinder). Thanks.
Metz SCA 3002.
Works with compatible Metz units.
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Metz SCA 3002.
Thank you, David. I'll look for one now.
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Never mind..
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George I think you exaggerate here's a crop taken at 1/30th available with the 100 @ 2.2:
Yeah, that's one frame, but show us the next four frames after that, that show camera shake. I had some sharp ones too, but nothing that instilled enough confidence that I'd go into a paying job, knowing that I had to deliver consistent frames. And there's no raising the mirror when you're shooting people.
And was that frame from an H1 or H2 with the Mirror Delay turned off completely?
Was it shot on a tripod, or just handheld? (Isnt' that you, bent over a Bogen, with the CA-magenta fringing in her reflections?)
I'm on your side, Nick, you know that. And even David's too. I love the H in so many ways. But with money on the table, no amount of Photoshop/post can fix camera shake. And you just know, with Murphy's Law, that one frame that the client "just loves" is the one with camera shake. We've all been there -- nobody wants to shoot a job with the same odds as rolling the dice in Vegas. In the end, my loyalty is with the guy that writes me the check; not the guy that sells me my tools.
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Was it shot on a tripod, or just handheld? (Isnt' that you, bent over a Bogen, with the CA-magenta fringing in her reflections?)
Gwyneth,
You never heard of an Eyevatar?
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Now Nick's gone and gotten his feelings hurt.
But in defense of Hasselblad, and to counter my bashing, I did a little experiment tonight, just to remind myself of the viewfinder issue. To see how nice the viewfinder is on the H, set up two (or three) tripods next to each other, close. On Tripod 1, mount an H body with an 80. On tripod 2, mount a 5D2 with a 50. One tripod 3, if you have it, stick on a 1ds3 with a 50. With all cameras, roughly frame up the scene. Then move your eye from one camera to the next, and then watch your jaw drop when you look through the viewfinder of the H body. It's a joy to look thru, each and every time.
I am working on the rendering of the new H vertical grip too. It'll be unveiled shortly.
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Now Nick's gone and gotten his feelings hurt.
But in defense of Hasselblad, and to counter my bashing, I did a little experiment tonight, just to remind myself of the viewfinder issue. To see how nice the viewfinder is on the H, set up two (or three) tripods next to each other, close. On Tripod 1, mount an H body with an 80. On tripod 2, mount a 5D2 with a 50. One tripod 3, if you have it, stick on a 1ds3 with a 50. With all cameras, roughly frame up the scene. Then move your eye from one camera to the next, and then watch your jaw drop when you look through the viewfinder of the H body. It's a joy to look thru, each and every time.
I am working on the rendering of the new H vertical grip too. It'll be unveiled shortly.
I would guess not hurt feelings, but more likely irritation.
But yes, thankyou for identifying the viewfinder experience.
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The only vibration that counts is what happens during the exposure - if you get vibration after the exposure (when the mirror comes down), it does not blur the image.
Have you tested this phenomenon personally, both handheld and tripod mounted? I have. So what were your findings?
My opinion now is that the H2 and H1 are tripod-only, mirror-up cameras, or, with-studio-strobe cameras, to kill this "lunging effect" from the body.
Testing or no testing, my statement is obviously correct... the implication is that vibration felt (in operator's hands) might not occur during the exposure.
I do not have an H1 or H2, and I bought my H3 mainly for view camera/studio flash/Metz flash work, and if I do use the point-and-shoot adaptor for landscapes, I lock the mirror up and use a tripod.
What procedure did you use for your tests?
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I would guess not hurt feelings, but more likely irritation.
Sometimes the truth hurts. So you pick up your blocks and go home.
I write all this to counter so many people's assertions here that "MF is better than Canon". Yes, in some circumstances, it is, if you're on a tripod, or if you've got 2400 W/S of Profoto behind you, in a dark studio. But if you think you can just grab that H2, throw it over your shoulder, and walk around handheld and shoot at 1/60th or 1/125th handheld in available light, you'll find that you have 31 or 39 or 50MP of glorious, blurred megapixels. Whereas with the Canon or Nikon or other CMOS camera, the ASAs are vastly different, the lenses are faster, and the mirror is smaller. And with low ASAs of a CCD camera, and slow lenses, there are many occasions when your meter tells you to shoot at 60th or 125th (or slower). So to that Hasselblad accessories page, I'd add a new flash, but also a new Carbon Fiber Tripod, 'cause you're going to need it, if you want sharp megapixels.
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Every time somebody says the H2 has mirror slap someone else says, "I routinely shoot my H2 at 1/4 of a second and everything is sharp".
Maybe, maybe not but I've shot a billion frames with the contax, especially using continuous light and it's much smoother than any camera I use including the Canons and Nikons.
Now I'll be the first to admit I'm not always that overly concerned with uber over sharp, see every pore from 6 blocks away photography and I'll admit that I've only shot an H series camera twice for projects, but the difference in the way it feels as far as mirror slap or vibration or whatever it's called feels like it's double that on the H series, or half that on the contax.
Now the downside is the contax has a small view through the prism (though quite large in a waist level finder) and the view in a H series is much larger (though in my experience the H series prism seems to bend the image which is not exactly in relation to the final image, which kind of breaks my brain.
I've pretty much placed the Contax as a specialty camera, rather than a 2000 frame a day lifestyle advertising camera. It will do 2000 frames a day, but you'll work hard at it compared to a dslr, less hard than most medium format cameras because it does have a 90 degree grip.
What I do love about the contax is the ability to put on a lot of different glass.
This image is with the old Boris Tilt shift lens, at 1/30th of a second and it's sharp where I want it to be, smooth and soft where I want that.
[attachment=17787:copyrigh...new_york.jpg]
This image also with the Hareblei 45mm Tilt Shift at 1/30th using modeling lights and an old Aptus 22.
[attachment=17790:copyrigh..._york_lk.jpg]
This second image is shot with the Contax 80mm Zeiss with flash and obviously it's pin point sharp, so the Contax does have a lot of versatility when it comes to glass.
[attachment=17788:copyrigh...arcelona.jpg]
I even have an adapter to use pentax 6x7 lenses which also have their own look and less bite than the standard Ziess lenses.
[attachment=17789:copyrigh...rk_divas.jpg]
JR
Everyone loves the Contax but shutter lag on it is terrible. I once did a whole shoot in the studio with people jumping and falling and it was hopeless for that. To be fair I'm not sure how much worse it is than any of the other medium format cameras because I've never done proper comparative tests but 35 mm or view cameras are way better.
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Have you tested this phenomenon personally, both handheld and tripod mounted? I have. So what were your findings?
My opinion now is that the H2 and H1 are tripod-only, mirror-up cameras, or, with-studio-strobe cameras, to kill this "lunging effect" from the body.
I have tests that show camera shake even on a giant Bogen tripod with that huge RRS Ballhead, shot with tungsten light, under controlled conditions. Maybe it's just my particular bod(ies), but others have reported this as well. It doesn't take a Lab Coat to feel a camera body lunging in your hands; only a working photographer who shoots regularly.
Nick's suggestion to introduce the mirror delay has certainly eased the problem, but it introduces new doubt when shooting people, when looking for fleeting facial expressions. You set it too high, and you're creeping uncomfortably close to Mamiya645 performance.
And again, I ain't "bashing" anybody. I'm just calling them as I see them. I'd complain about Canon or Nikon if it did the same thing, (but it doesn't). My advice: If you own an H, you ought to also own a solid tripod, and learn how to set up the User Button to raise the mirror. What was infuriating to me was: I realized I'd just laid out tens of thousands of dollars for a "medium format solution" that REQUIRED me shooting with a tripod. That's fine, if you're a studio photographer, but grim news if you're a location guy. I'd, in effect, spent big money on a view camera. Not good.
You can shoot with no mirror delay, 50-110mm monster lens, 100 ISO, F8, 1/250 in sunlight and get no problems with blur. Indeed exceptionally sharp pictures. I've done a few fashion shoots like this.
Not saying the mirror slap doesn't suck though and I wish you could go to even 1/125 reliably. As I've pointed out elsewhere you can hand-hold an RZ reliably at 1/60 with a 90mm lens so I don't quite know what went wrong when they designed the H.
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[quote name='Nick-T' date='Nov 4 2009, 02:50 AM' post='322347']
>This has been resolved with current versions.
I'm away from the studio again for a few days, however once back I'll trying capturing some images without any adjustments. (levels, etc) Here's what I'm seeing currently - set a crop that causes the preview to end up around 20% to 24%. (After setting the crop, click on the crop tool to bring the preview up as large as possible within the preview window.) If I click on the "+" to zoom to 25%, it is noticeably sharper.
>I'm fairly sure this was a bug that has been fixed.
Excellent. Next time I see the "Phocus unexpectedly quit" window I'll know it's just an illusion. Seriously, though...Phocus 1.2.1 running on OS X 10.5.8 on a one year old dual quad core mac. I've fixed permissions, run maintenance scripts and have about 150GB free. Not sure what else to look at. There is not much besides CS4, Phocus, and C1 on this computer.
>How slow is slow? What times are you getting with "standard" setup (turning on the moire filter for example will slow processing right down)
I'm not saying Phocus is slow, just that if the original poster is thinking about using a laptop to process large quantities of files, they might be disappointed. I wouldn't put Phocus in the realms of Lightroom 1 or 2 for processing speed, but the quality is certainly much better with Phocus. This really comes back to testing the equipment in your own particular situation to see what the "fit" is like. If it matters, my laptop is about 1/3 the speed of my desktop tower.
The moire filter will slow things down, however when it is needed, it is definitely an excellent feature that seems to work quite well in many situations.
Darren Bernaerdt
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You can shoot with no mirror delay, 50-110mm monster lens, 100 ISO, F8, 1/250 in sunlight and get no problems with blur. Indeed exceptionally sharp pictures. I've done a few fashion shoots like this.
Not saying the mirror slap doesn't suck though and I wish you could go to even 1/125 reliably. As I've pointed out elsewhere you can hand-hold an RZ reliably at 1/60 with a 90mm lens so I don't quite know what went wrong when they designed the H.
If Gwitif really wants that medium format experience, how bout saving a few tens of thousands and sending a Canon to these guys to have the AA filter removed.
http://www.maxmax.com/hot_rod_visible.htm (http://www.maxmax.com/hot_rod_visible.htm)
You'll get that medium format uber sharp look of course sometimes some moire like a medium format back, but it doesn't cost much.
Now if you want more of the medium format loving feeling, you'll need to stick a wad of bubble gum over the shutter release and glue down the iso so it won't go past 400.
That'll do it.
BC
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As I've pointed out elsewhere you can hand-hold an RZ reliably at 1/60 with a 90mm lens so I don't quite know what went wrong when they designed the H.
The RZ mirror doesn't flip back up.
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The RZ mirror doesn't flip back up.
Yes, but the mirror flipping back up necessarily happens after the exposure has been made so has no influence on image sharpness.
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This has nothing to do with anything, (except for the rich history of the Hasselblad camera), but this book is just stunning. A good friend sent me this book for Christmas, and it's just so addicting. This photographer shot a handheld Hasselblad next to a Japanese temple, and pulled interesting people off the streets. Spent maybe ten minutes with each person. Just such an achievement. Years of work and dedication.
http://www.steidlville.com/books/709-Asaku...iroh-Kikai.html (http://www.steidlville.com/books/709-Asakusa-Portraits-Hiroh-Kikai.html)
Click thru the sample spreads. It's a shame they don't show up larger, to see the tonality and the captions.
EDIT: I found this interesting paragraph on page 26, as he describes his working process at this temple: "Once I enter the temple grounds, I walk along the crimson wall that forms the backdrop of my portraits, checking the light. My outdoor studio is a little dusty, so I take a tissue out of my pocket pack with the consumer credit ad on it that someone was handing to passersby at the station and dust off the wall a bit. Then I take out of my daybag the Hasselblad that I've been using for thirty-odd years, and sling it over my shoulder. With these simple preparations, I feel myself click into work mode."
Emphasis is mine.
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If Gwitif really wants that medium format experience, how bout saving a few tens of thousands and sending a Canon to these guys to have the AA filter removed.
Coot,
You know as well as anybody that "saving a few tens of thousands" is NOT a part of the medium format experience...
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I don't see so many, and I see more than a few assertions that Canon is better than MF.
But WTF, who cares, I'd ignore them all, they're all fools. The two formats are just different.
Exactly.
Buy the camera to do what you want it to do. It's only a tool. There isn't one perfect camera to rule them all, not even for a single photographer shooting several different subjects... and certainly not for many photographers shooting many different subjects. Find the one that feels like it is helping your way of working and whose shots you like to look at for your sort of work, and use that for the job. If you can't find one, find the one you hate the least... or build your own.
And by all means share your experiences, but bear in mind that other people's mileages may vary... and please avoid ad hominem attacks, or whatever the equivalent to ad hominem is when you are having a go at a company rather than a person. It is quite tiresome.
As I said earlier in the thread, I like my 'blad for my fetish photography, but if I was shooting a football match, I'd reach for my Canon kit. And if I were to go back into mountain photography professionally, I'd be in the market for one of those Fuji 6 x 17 cm monster cameras I think. And if I wanted to do unobtrusive reportage, you could probably do a lot worse than a compact in your pocket.
Cheers, Hywel
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If Gwitif really wants that medium format experience, how bout saving a few tens of thousands and sending a Canon to these guys to have the AA filter removed.
http://www.maxmax.com/hot_rod_visible.htm (http://www.maxmax.com/hot_rod_visible.htm)
You'll get that medium format uber sharp look of course sometimes some moire like a medium format back, but it doesn't cost much.
Now if you want more of the medium format loving feeling, you'll need to stick a wad of bubble gum over the shutter release and glue down the iso so it won't go past 400.
That'll do it.
BC
Has anyone you know tried this mod on their Canons? Sounds very interesting.
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Has anyone you know tried this mod on their Canons? Sounds very interesting.
I've done it on my 5D MkII.
there's a very subtle difference, where edges used to blend (lightgrey-grey-black-grey-lightgrey) now it's more like (grey-black-grey)
most people don't see the difference but I've found it useful esp when uprezzing (where edges tend to start looking fuzzier...and no, sharpening does not do the exact same thing)
btw only one out of 2 AA filters get removed due to the way the glass inside is constructed.
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]
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David/Nick,
Just a loving, constructive thought about a feature for the H5D: What if, instead of the LCD display on the grip sloping forward, away from the photographer, what about redesigning that grip (when you add the vertical grip), and make that LCD panel slope/tilt backwards, toward the photographer's view? As it is right now, when I'm shooting people, at eye level, I have to break the camera from the tripod lock-down position, and tilt the whole camera backwards, toward me, in order to view the LCD, and then reposition it. If the LCD panel was tilted backwards slightly, kinda that that Hy6, all you'd have to do is glance down to see the LCD panel on the grip to confirm your settings. I know it wouldn't be as aerodynamic that way, but it would be much more functional for the photographer. Thanks.
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David/Nick,
Just a loving, constructive thought about a feature for the H5D: What if, instead of the LCD display on the grip sloping forward, away from the photographer, what about redesigning that grip (when you add the vertical grip), and make that LCD panel slope/tilt backwards, toward the photographer's view? As it is right now, when I'm shooting people, at eye level, I have to break the camera from the tripod lock-down position, and tilt the whole camera backwards, toward me, in order to view the LCD, and then reposition it. If the LCD panel was tilted backwards slightly, kinda that that Hy6, all you'd have to do is glance down to see the LCD panel on the grip to confirm your settings. I know it wouldn't be as aerodynamic that way, but it would be much more functional for the photographer. Thanks.
Why not just make that display a "flip up" display? Shouldn't be too difficult to do.
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Why not just make that display a "flip up" display? Shouldn't be too difficult to do.
Personally, I would not want anything to flip up -- just another thing to get broken off. Just like those flip-out LCD screens on video cameras -- an accident waiting to happen. I'd just reform that grip, but switch the pitch of that LCD readout the other way, so the user could just look down to know what fstop he's on.
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Personally, I would not want anything to flip up -- just another thing to get broken off.
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hen you look through the viewfinder of the H body. It's a joy to look thru, each and every time.
I am working on the rendering of the new H vertical grip too. It'll be unveiled shortly.
I have never heard anyone mention the H series camera without mentioning the grip, usually not in that positive of a manner, so if I've heard it dozens of times I'm sure Hasselblad is also aware of it.
I don't think (just conjecture) that any medium format camera is going to change that much. Maybe somebody like Leica will make a brand new one, but to change an existing one seems to take forever.
It did in the film days when it costs a lot less to make a change in a camera, but now that it's digital it seems everything gets much more expensive and very time delayed.
Even Canon with their 1 series body hasn't changed that in a dozen years so maybe it's just too expensive to make wholesale changes.
The funny thing is the cheap point and shoot cameras seem to change by the hour, but expensive professional cameras change by the decade.
But I'm not too sure if you or any professional photographer is the real market for expensive cameras anymore.
I think this is the market.
(http://p1podas.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/podas-blog-group-shot1.jpg)
BC
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I must be in the minority because I love the way the Hasselblad fits in my hand. I think it is tremendously easy to shoot and very well balanced. I always felt that the DMR was lens heavy while the H3d-50 seems to be balanced tight to the front of the camera. I love holding it while shooting it.
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I must be in the minority because I love the way the Hasselblad fits in my hand. I think it is tremendously easy to shoot and very well balanced. I always felt that the DMR was lens heavy while the H3d-50 seems to be balanced tight to the front of the camera. I love holding it while shooting it.
[/b]
That's an expensive feeling, but possibly well worth it. (Just a joke, Keith, honest!)
I remember that many years ago, in one of those leaflets that Hasselbad used to produce now and again, they ran an article on mirror vibration. In it, they published two photographs of the same subject, tripod mounted, one with MU and the other without MU. Their point, and illustration to prove it, was that it is impossible for any MF camera to be free of mirror-induced vibration because of the kinetic energy released by all that weight.
I thought it very honest of H and I guess they were willing to demonstrate the point simply because the competition couldn't do any better. So what can be expected to have changed? Physics is physics. My greatest disappointment when moving from my second-hand Rollei T to my first brand-new Hasselblad 500C was there in my face the first shoot I did with it in the fresh air, hand-held with the basic 80mm. That hellish bounce. I have to agree with an earlier poster that some cameras more or les demand either tripods or studio flash or both!
Rob C
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[!--quoteo(post=324671:date=Nov 13 2009, 12:24 PM:name=)--][div class=\'quotetop\']QUOTE ( @ Nov 13 2009, 12:24 PM) [a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=324671\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a][div class=\'quotemain\'][!--quotec--]I love holding it while shooting it.[/quote]
some actually love holding it more than shooting it
(... cameras, that is)
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I must be in the minority because I love the way the Hasselblad fits in my hand. I think it is tremendously easy to shoot and very well balanced. I always felt that the DMR was lens heavy while the H3d-50 seems to be balanced tight to the front of the camera. I love holding it while shooting it.
I love the hasselblad body and the grip as well. I have no idea why some people complain about it. I mostly shoot verticals in studio and am very happy with the grip. Would never go for a vertical one.
Alex
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You are definitely in the minority I guess from the sound of it. I have no real issues holding the H but I surely can think of numerous little things that I believe are quite easy to change that would make holding it a much nicer experience.
A vertical grip might be a real task to do but how about having dents in the battery to fit your fingers? Or how about putting the backside wheel just slightly more towards the middle so you can reach it with your thumb while still keeping a fairly good grip on the body? Ever tried putting a remote in the body? The placing of these small things can make a big difference. It should not be that hard to at least have a look at that.
I can remember when I changed from a D200 to a D300 where Nikon slightly altered the angle of the rear and front dial so it would feel more natural and easy to use. Which it did.
Great image of the intended market BTW....
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Ever tried putting a remote in the body?
Yes, remote control socket could go on the left side of the body. But I am happy with the smooth grip and the control wheel location.
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Yes, remote control socket could go on the left side of the body. But I am happy with the smooth grip and the control wheel location.
I am happy with the batter grip and control wheel location as well. They fit perfectly for me.
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some actually love holding it more than shooting it
(... cameras, that is)
VERY true.
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Great image of the intended market BTW....
I'm not making light of this podas group, I just think this is where the market for expensive cameras is heading.
Obviously Phase One thinks so because they set this up for this group, not at the Piers or Smashbox.
It's interesting that one of the best photographers I know opens his website with new images shot with the Panasonic G camera and the format doesn't change anything, it's the content and he like most of us realizes that it's the content and his talent that moves him forward, not the camera.
I think this podas* group is the perfect market for this 60 something megapixel cameras because they do photography for the enjoyment, without the pressures of budget restraints and 10 clients staring into a monitor. They have the time to reflect on their images without deadlines and if they take an extra hour to shoot something, it doesn't break the budget.
I personally hope they all buy new cameras, because that will keep the makers going.
BC
*I do think there should have been a rethink on the name podas though.
Just POA, is easier to understand and sounds better to say I'm a Phase One Artist, rather than a podas.
IMO
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"Recession? What recession...?"
Compared to Hasselblad's www.hassynyc.com, and their Target Market, it looks like Phase is going after the right segment -- the ones with cash and disposable income.
Seems smart to me. Not quite as sexy as Hasselblad, but a good business move maybe.
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I am happy with the batter grip and control wheel location as well. They fit perfectly for me.
Really? For me the wheels seem to far away from my fingers. Where they fall right under my thumb and middle finger with my Nikons I have a hard time on the Hasselblad. They are simply too far away. The back wheel is sofar away the body almost falls out of your hand when you want to dial in something and holding the body in your right hand only.
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Really? For me the wheels seem to far away from my fingers. Where they fall right under my thumb and middle finger with my Nikons I have a hard time on the Hasselblad. They are simply too far away. The back wheel is sofar away the body almost falls out of your hand when you want to dial in something and holding the body in your right hand only.
Everyone has different sized hands I guess. Fits me perfectly.
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I feel like I need to jump in at this point...
I have asked for a vertical grip every time I've had the chance, I guess most like to shoot off a tripod.
here is an image of yours truly from the last week. Some one at H should try hand holding this combo in vertical format all day long, and then tell me how comfy it is at the end of the day.
and every time I had to let go of the camera with my left hand for a split second to gesture or direct people on set, honestly the battery felt like it can snap right off (has actually happened to me with the 55-110)
Even low end DSLR's ship with optional vertical grips, why is this so impossible for Hasselblad?
anyways...
am
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I have asked for a vertical grip every time I've had the chance, I guess most like to shoot off a tripod.
If you use a 4Kg camera hand-held all day, you can do without going to the gym in the evening!
The camera would still be heavy even with a vertical grip ... have you tried/considered a monopod?
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If you use a 4Kg camera hand-held all day, you can do without going to the gym in the evening!
The camera would still be heavy even with a vertical grip ... have you tried/considered a monopod?
One of the new Manfrottos with the pistol grip and compressed air might be good for this type of use...
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honestly the battery felt like it can snap right off (has actually happened to me with the 55-110)
Even low end DSLR's ship with optional vertical grips, why is this so impossible for Hasselblad?
Arashm,
I love this picture, in so many ways. I want to take it, and open it in Photoshop, and add Canvas, with a bunch of white around your head, and then take a bunch of those Cartoon Bubbles, and paste them in above your head. These would be all the thoughts that are coming out of your brain, simultaneously, while you're shooting that job.
(And for the record, I was shooting a studio job once, too, with the H1, and literally had the Grip break off in my hand too. Somehow we got it back on, and the camera kept going, but i've been scared of that grip ever since.)
These would be the Cartoon Bubbles of your thoughts, in any given moment:
1. "Wow, this feels like the old Modern Detective magazine, where they put the black bar over the eyes, to conceal their identity. Great design, Pocket Wizard!" (Or did Pocket Wizard and Hasselblad design it this way on purpose, in order to keep your attention on the viewfinder image?)
2. "My left arm hurts."
3. "I'm trying to keep the horizon level, but I've got my left arm sorta against my chest, and trying to keep my elbow against my chest, in order to get a break from the weight, but I've got my right hand on the Grip, but I need to change Fstop by a half-stop, but when I take my Right Thumb from where it is, and try to move that Wheel, I get a CharleyHorse".
4. "I'm hungry. Are there bagels here?"
5. LeftBrain: "What is it, f8, or fFive Six and a half...? Can somebody take a Reading?" Right Brain: "How is the light, is it too centered, is it too boring, should I roll the keylight stand over to the right, to give it more Shadow?"
6. "Damn, did I just break off the PocketWizard with my forehead?"
7. "Wow my left arm REALLY hurts now. What time is it?"
8. "If we're shooting strobe, why didn't somebody put some foamcore up in those window to black them out. My LeftBrain is getting fooled."
9. "Where is the client?"
10. "Man, it sure would be nice to have a Vertical Grip for this camera, so I could just stand normally, in a vertical position, and rest both arms against my chest, like they taught me in school, even though I'm shooting strobe, but where I wouldn't have a CharleyHorse by the third shot. Does anybody have the name of a good Chiropractor?"
11. "How much glass do they really NEED to put into a 50-110 anyway? Seriously".
12. "God, I hope I get paid on this gig. At least we billed the TREC rental direct".
13. "How come it's easier for the Talent to see what fstop I'm on, than me?"
14. "I know I told that model that I was that guy on Entourage on HBO, but the way she's looking at me, I'm not sure she's buying it. What's that that just fell out of her nose?".
15. "Did the front element just fall out of my lens? What's that on the floor?"
16. "God, I'm glad I sold them on shooting this job with Strobe. Can you imagine trying to hold this camera all day long, in this position, shooting window light, at 1/60th...?"
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*I do think there should have been a rethink on the name podas though.
Just POA, is easier to understand and sounds better to say I'm a Phase One Artist, rather than a podas.
IMO
PITA was already taken
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By the end of the years we all will keep thinking what will be the best camera/beer
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For the Record I shoot both Hasselblad and Phase, don't own but rent, and sometimes the decision is based on lens availability or even a "deal/special" at a rental house. I'm good with phocus and C1, also shoot tons of canon and my new fav. camera is the panny GF1
so you can figure out where I sit on this for yourself.
Dick Roadnight:
it's not the weight that's a problem, and yes a vertical grip would add even more weight, it's that to hold the camera in vertical you now have to extend your right arm and elbow high and away from your body, with nothing to brace it on, and your wrist is holding the weight down under your arm and wrist.
any support would have to come from your left hand, a vertical grip will allow your elbows to be down by your sides and even supported by your torso.
On this shoot there is too much movement on set to keep up with, I would just use a tripod if I went the monopod route.
GWHITF:
your comments made me laugh partly because they are very close to my reality.
Do as you wish with the image and post it back if you want, should be fun.
4) we actually had this excellent home made yogurt and granola as part of the breaky spread, definitely a hit.
5) NO keep the light in the center, everyone wants edgy and modern on set but you know better that you'll have to clean up the shadow's in post to make it "clean and safe".
6) True, why are the new PW plus 2's made so cheap and plasticky?
12) Umm Yes, but I do take 50% up front almost always, been around the track too many times now to fall for that one....
16) Actually I shoot a lot of Kino Flo stuff, hence the canon usage.
On a more serious note, I do enjoy shooting with H Blad, it's just that the vertical grip thing is a bit of a sore spot for me (no pun)
There is a couple of things I'd like to see and refined in Phocus and I think I'll get them in 2.0...
The LCD on the back is good, I can still get the info I need from it, there is actually a direction pad so I can zoom in and go around in all 4 directions...
And for the most part I think the glass is great.
Wish it had a few more focus points... and in general there is room for improvement.
anyways, back to running files
am
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Metz SCA 3002.
Works with compatible Metz units.
Mr David Grover:
Can you advise? Metz website shows four flash units compatible with H2. I want the Meat Tenderizer design, with the handle and the whacker. B&H lists these two. Can you advise which is most compatible, easier to use, with H2? Thank you.
Metz 76 MZ-5: http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo (http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo)
Metz 45 CL-4 http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq (http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq)
They also list some of these as "Basic Kit" and others as "Digital Kit". Is there a YouTube video anywhere that shows how to hook up one of these Metzes to my H2?
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Mr David Grover:
Is there a YouTube video anywhere that shows how to hook up one of these Metzes to my H2?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYWDfPE5dik...feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYWDfPE5dik&feature=related)
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Mr David Grover:
Can you advise? Metz website shows four flash units compatible with H2. I want the Meat Tenderizer design, with the handle and the whacker. B&H lists these two. Can you advise which is most compatible, easier to use, with H2? Thank you.
Metz 76 MZ-5: http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo (http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo)
Metz 45 CL-4 http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq (http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq)
They also list some of these as "Basic Kit" and others as "Digital Kit". Is there a YouTube video anywhere that shows how to hook up one of these Metzes to my H2?
Well both work with the H, so it depends what features you need from the flash itself?
http://www.metz.de/en/photo-electronics/me...nformation.html (http://www.metz.de/en/photo-electronics/mecablitz-models/sca-flash-units/mecablitz-76-mz-5-digital/product-information.html)
Specs are listed there.
As for hooking it up, you need the SCA adapter which goes on the hotshoe. Looks like on the 76 unit you have the additional 'box' which goes on the shoe, on the cheaper 45 unit then a sync cable goes from hot shoe to hammerhead.
D
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Dick Roadnight:
it's not the weight that's a problem, and yes a vertical grip would add even more weight, it's that to hold the camera in vertical you now have to extend your right arm and elbow high and away from your body, with nothing to brace it on, and your wrist is holding the weight down under your arm and wrist.
any support would have to come from your left hand, a vertical grip will allow your elbows to be down by your sides and even supported by your torso.
On this shoot there is too much movement on set to keep up with, I would just use a tripod if I went the monopod route.
The problem is that you support the whole weight of the camera with your left hand… one technique for relieving your aching muscles occasionally is to hold the camera the other way up… it is not easy to use the shutter button like that with your “trigger” finger, but it is easier if you use your thumb for the shutter button.
If the vertical grip was designed as a replacement hand grip/battery holder with a shutter button on it, it would not increase the weight significantly… but it would be better if it incorporated a balance slider so that you could get the centre of gravity of the camera over you hand for one hand operation.
Any grip should ideally be designed so that you can use the camera horizontally in between vertical shots.
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I write all this to counter so many people's assertions here that "MF is better than Canon". Yes, in some circumstances, it is, if you're on a tripod, or if you've got 2400 W/S of Profoto behind you, in a dark studio. But if you think you can just grab that H2, throw it over your shoulder, and walk around handheld and shoot at 1/60th or 1/125th handheld in available light, you'll find that you have 31 or 39 or 50MP of glorious, blurred megapixels. Whereas with the Canon or Nikon or other CMOS camera, the ASAs are vastly different, the lenses are faster, and the mirror is smaller. And with low ASAs of a CCD camera, and slow lenses, there are many occasions when your meter tells you to shoot at 60th or 125th (or slower). So to that Hasselblad accessories page, I'd add a new flash, but also a new Carbon Fiber Tripod, 'cause you're going to need it, if you want sharp megapixels.
Hello everybody !
that's funny, I've just come back from Death Valley ( and from Yosemite) where I met the podas group (a group with girls .. hmm models ...lol) and Michael Reichman. As I'm just a photographer with an H3D31, I didn't mix in hostile territory (joke, yes, Michael, I was the guy next to you at breakfast the last morning). I do photography alone and those workshops are not for me.
Just to say, I was wondering all those days : "but for what reason all those guys, specially those with Nikon/Canon cameras are shooting with tripods ?". At night, ok ! But, in the middle of Death Valley with lot light available, I don't see the reason why. I do landscape photography, and at the best, I use a monopod, but no tripod. All my photos are hand held and they are all sharp !
At Yosemite, at 9 am, you have a photographic tour (1hour !) from the Ansel Adams Gallery. I met the group at the lower Falls, everybody with a tripod (ouuuuh too funny) and I can tell, I was the only one with my Hasselblad without a tripod
I read here someone also saying that the rich people are the market of podas and that they are very demanding in hardware but that they have no artistic needs. That's nonsense, who can tell for everybody artistic needs ? We can see here a lot of good photographs from professional photographers, but very few with artistic quality. A girl (sorry, a model) with a strong flash in the face, a beautiful haircut and a makeup that looks like a plastic doll is not what I call "artistic photography". Just modeling and commercial photography.
My conclusion ?
"please, speak from your experiences, not from prejudices !"
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Maybe enough actual *customers* of Hasselblad have spoken by now, so that they will get a vertical grip?
Edmund
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Maybe enough actual *customers* of Hasselblad have spoken by now, so that they will get a vertical grip?
Edmund
We would buy two of those, too!
Cheers, Ulf
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Mr David Grover:
Can you advise? Metz website shows four flash units compatible with H2. I want the Meat Tenderizer design, with the handle and the whacker. B&H lists these two. Can you advise which is most compatible, easier to use, with H2? Thank you.
Metz 76 MZ-5: http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo (http://tinyurl.com/yj58jwo)
Metz 45 CL-4 http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq (http://tinyurl.com/yl23wnq)
They also list some of these as "Basic Kit" and others as "Digital Kit". Is there a YouTube video anywhere that shows how to hook up one of these Metzes to my H2?
LOL, the "meat tenderizer", that one was worth the visit today I will never be able to look at that flash again without chuckling...
You can also use the SCA 3008 extender to place the flash 4 feet away (or use PW for longer)
John
hotwire-digital.com