Luminous Landscape Forum
Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: Guigui on November 01, 2009, 10:32:07 am
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Hello,
I'm wondering how long I can expect a recent inkjet wide format printer (I have an Epson Stylus Pro 7900) to last before it needs to be replaced ?
For example, how long have you been using your older wide format printers ? How often do you need to replace a broken part ?
I suppose it depends on the printer model and frequency of use, but any experience would be great to hear. Thanks !
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Depends on many factors. Amount of use and or abuse. If you are concerned about it not holding up you can purchase the 2 year extended warranty for about $700.00 a year. I have the 7900 for about a year now and bought a 9900 last week. I am pretty much planning on upgrading after 3 years 4 max. Someone else may have to chime in on longevity history issues on their printers.
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I don’t have a direct answer but in general computer devices are designed to last about 4 years. The hard drive (if equipped) or circuitry will probably start to fail at that time.
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A long time for 7800's and 9800's, I know of a few heavily used examples that are still going strong after more than 2 years with seemingly no maintenance. Between my old 7800 and newer 9880 I've got over 1600 square meters of prints with nothing more than occasional nozzle clogs, and of recent I've finally figured out how to avoid those almost entirely. That's good product design, IMHO. I have heard a few horror stories online, but for the printers I actually know about reliability seems excellent. If you plan to buy the warranty do it as soon as possible, at least for the 98's Epson places time and usage limits on warranty renewals.
I expect the 9880 will last at least another year or two with moderate to heavy use.
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Hello,
I'm wondering how long I can expect a recent inkjet wide format printer (I have an Epson Stylus Pro 7900) to last before it needs to be replaced ?
For example, how long have you been using your older wide format printers ? How often do you need to replace a broken part ?
I suppose it depends on the printer model and frequency of use, but any experience would be great to hear. Thanks !
Unless you're printing at commercial volumes, you'll probably want to upgrade due to improvements in inkset or technology long before the printer actually dies. My Epson 7600 was gathering dust for several years after I moved on to an HP Z3100; it still worked fine, but its mediocre performance on coated papers led me to 'retire' it by giving it a home with a local art shop/print studio. The 7600 is built like an anvil; it still works just fine.
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I agree with Geoff...technology will cause mine to be replaced long before it's useful life is up. I probably had my 7600 for 5 years and it still works just fine, the jumped to the 7900 since it is so superior.
Bill, care to share what you have discovered about nozzle clogs and how to prevent them?
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I suppose it depends on the printer model and frequency of use, but any experience would be great to hear. Thanks !
Considering that printing for fine art applications will be most probably mostly be gone in 10 years from now, I don't expect to have to replace my 9900 more than once...
Cheers,
Bernard
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Considering that printing for fine art applications will be most probably mostly be gone in 10 years from now, I don't expect to have to replace my 9900 more than once...
Bummer!
Where did you get that information?
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Thanks everyone for sharing their thoughts. I will try to contact Epson support to see if I can still get the "service pack" warranty extension for my 7900 (which I received almost a year ago).
Considering that printing for fine art applications will be most probably mostly be gone in 10 years from now, I don't expect to have to replace my 9900 more than once...
Cheers,
Bernard
I'm quite puzzled by this statement. Would you care to elaborate on why you think fine art printing will be gone so soon ?
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I was on a waiting list for a 9800 and got one of the first ones out. After about four and one half years it's still going strong (here is the obligatory knock on wood). All I've had to do is replace the ink and do head cleaning. Actually, I don't know how long they last.
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Thanks everyone for sharing their thoughts. I will try to contact Epson support to see if I can still get the "service pack" warranty extension for my 7900 (which I received almost a year ago).
I'm quite puzzled by this statement. Would you care to elaborate on why you think fine art printing will be gone so soon ?
Just imagine the thin film monitors and displays we will be able to hang in 10 years time.
I like paper and would not want to read a Kindle device but Bernard's projection will be true for the majority.
Bob
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"Considering that printing for fine art applications will be most probably mostly be gone in 10 years from now"
Huh? Big/little down loadable flat screen projections will rule the world? Perhaps, If that's true don't get rid of your fancy printer - In the upcoming brave new world - your paper prints, if they are good, will be even more valuable....
Howard
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Bill, care to share what you have discovered about nozzle clogs and how to prevent them?
EDIT: I should have said regular old paper towels like you buy in bundles of 6 at the supermarket. Bounty, etc. To add a professional touch you can use the more or less lint-free blue paper towels made by Scott available in the painting section at Lowe's.
Most of the clogs I was getting were from dirt accumulating on the carriage mechanism near the heads. Or that's my working model. Sooner or later enough canvas dust, house dust, and ink would make a potent putty that would break off and start frolicking on the nozzles. The symptom of this is the type of clog is that suddenly several patches on the top row of the "Auto" patches will drop out, and sometimes even move around between colors on subsequent cleaning cycles. Very expensive to clear this type of clog using normal cleaning cycles.
The solution for me was to get very pro-actively preventive about this. To simplify, about every 300 square feet with the machine off I work a moist (but not dripping), triply folded paper towel down into the media path, then drag the heads over it once or twice. Move the paper towel down 1.5 inches, a couple more drags. You get about 4 bidirectional drags per towel. Repeat for two or three paper towels or until not much changes between swipes.
That's it, I almost never have clogs, the machine comes up and I print a test pattern and 9 days out of ten just works great, and on the tenth day maybe one cleaning cycle. Have not had a multi-sheet, knock-down, drag-out, hair-pulling, epithet-screaming cleaning battle since I started doing this. It's miraculous. Am I doing irreparable damage to something? I don't know.
Oh also between uses I leave a wet sponge in a plastic tray near the heads. Figure out a way so you don't forget it's there.
Also I always store the printer with the pressure lever engaged, remove any media so you don't get dents. Seems to help, and makes me feel like I'm in control.
Details...
You need some kind of substrate stiffener behind the triply folded moist paper towel, I use a 8.5 x 11 piece of paper folded to be 4.25 x 11. The paper towel is folded so it is about the same size and shape. The best way to moisten the towels is to fling some drops of water onto the open towel with your fingers, then scrunch it up real good, then open it again and fold.
Fold about 1" of the towel around the back of the 4.25 inch substrate dimension so you can get the thing through the feed, with the pressure lever released. Take the actual swipes with the pressure lever engaged.
After about 2 swipe rows you will have to be extra attentive not hanging up the carriage on the towels. Just keep pushing the towel away from you so you clear the carriage.
Until you are finesseful at this you will hang up on the towel quite often, learn to deal with it.
Rather that letting the dirty parts of the towel feed down into the lower paper guide, fold them towards you at a right angle, this is also useful for pushing the towel out of the way of the carriage while swiping.
With the carriage pulled away from it's parking position, you can see the cross-hatched, ultra-grimy wiping pad. Once in a while I give this a pat with a very clean, slightly moist towel. I think it's best not to wipe it down too much since this seems to remove the lubrication and you get a squeaky sound until the grime reestablishes itself.
You release the 98xx carriage by pressing down on the blue thingy.
Remember, we're talking about notoriously filthy canvas media here, an RC guy should not have to do this very often at all which is my recollection from my own RC days.
So, good luck. Please use this technique at your own risk, as far as I know it's OK on the long term, then again it might be a formula for disaster. Have a nice day.
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Bummer!
Where did you get that information?
My hairdresser told me about it, he is usually pretty reliable.
Cheers,
Bernard
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My hairdresser told me about it, he is usually pretty reliable.
I understand he was a very successful photographer, then decided to move into a profession where he could actually make some money!
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Can't speak as to wide printers as I have a 3800. I ran 1,400 prints - about 94,000 sq. in. through the 3800 before I had to replace the ASF at a cost of $150. Most of these prints were on MOAB Entrada which, being double sided, is tough on the rollers. At times I wouldn't print for several months and have never had a single clog. Not sure you can wear out an Epson printer before you want to upgrade to newer technology.
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I think you can potentially have your printer for quite some time! The 9900 looks to be a good machine and well built, the expected life depends a lot on the type and quantity of material you print on as well as the environment the printer lives in, (as well as a bit of luck). I've seen Epson 9000's that are still in use that are stored in unheated shops, Epson 10600s that are still going strong and many people who have HP 5000 that they wish would finally die. Some printers are built better than other's but for the most part they usually become outdated before they break. Probably the hardest physical conditions I've seen on printers are very high volume environment where the users are printing on some sort of heavy matte paper. The constant cutting and the dust that is created as a byproduct can cause issues. In the case of the 9900 though the cutter is separate from the head so this may help somewhat. Also there is no HD in the Epson like in the HP's. You can expect to potentially replace something on a printer at some point, pump and cap assemblies come to mind...but it's like replacing the fuel pump and shocks on a car with a 100K miles, If you like the car it's an easy decision. It's also easier to justify repairs on a 6K printer, when something breaks on a $600 printer it's time to buy a new one.
On a Philosophical note...I'm not sure that all art is going to move to the digital dimension, just think how many digital displays you would need to display a moderate collection of prints! How do you display the depth of oil paintings on an LCD screen, or even the subtle texture of a fine art print? Also there is something quite nice about having something that still exists when the power goes out. I had the opportunity to see some some prints from the some of William Blake's engravings, made over 150 years ago and the quality and depth of those prints was just beautiful, the offset reproductions looked like absolute crap. It's like music, sure I like the convenience of having 8 days's worth of music on my phone, but does it compare to listening to a well mastered LP on a good sounds system sitting in your living room? my 2 cents.
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For the 9800 3-4 years of hard usage will knock out the carriage bearings probably
hard usage being round the clock proofing at a printers
replacing the cutter (under the blue thingy which you press to release the carriage!) when its worn
stops a lot of the dust and rubbish, for canvas you can put an external cutter
It looks like this issue is resolved in 9900
edwin
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I went 8 and 9 years on a pair of HP5000's. They were still working well when I sold them and replaced them. I changed belts every 3 years, and that was pretty much it. Both were well used, about $75,000 per year of output from each.
I replaced them with Canon's, because of the poor technical support from HP.
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Sooner or later enough canvas dust, house dust, and ink would make a potent putty that would break off and start frolicking on the nozzles. The symptom of this is the type of clog is that suddenly several patches on the top row of the "Auto" patches will drop out, and sometimes even move around between colors on subsequent cleaning cycles...
I work a moist (but not dripping), triply folded paper towel down into the media path, then drag the heads over it once or twice. Move the paper towel down 1.5 inches, a couple more drags. You get about 4 bidirectional drags per towel. Repeat for two or three paper towels or until not much changes between swipes.
That's it, I almost never have clogs
Excellent report, Bill! You describe EXACTLY the symptoms I encounter with my Epson 4800, especially the "auto clean" symptoms. I've used the wet paper towel solution on desktop Epsons, but never on my 4800. Now, I'm going to try it.
THANK YOU!
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First of all, thanks again to everyone who answered my question. Once again, I'm astonished by how helpful the community is around here.
I ordered a warranty extension from Epson a few days ago, since my original one-year warranty was going to expire in mid november.
One thing I don't get though, is the price. Here in France, the warranty renewal costs 1020 EUR excluding taxes for a 3-year extension. Someone said earlier in this thread that extensions costed about $700 a year for a 7900. On the price list on Epson France, there is no word about a yearly fee. Does that mean that I will be charged 1020 EUR each year for 3 years ? Can anyone in France or Europe confirm this ?
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I believe the warrany works this way...
You can buy a one or two year warranty extension, but only during the first year you own a new printer. The total number of years Epson will warrany your printer is 3 years, including the first year. So it's either 1 + 1 + 1 or 1 + 2.
Here's the US warranty statement...
http://files.support.epson.com/pdf/pro7880/pro7880wa.pdf (http://files.support.epson.com/pdf/pro7880/pro7880wa.pdf)
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You can also get warranty coverage from 3rd party groups. Most bigger cities have several groups who do printer service & repair. The printer doesn’t have to be in warranty at the time, but has to be shown to be working. Sometimes it is a better value going through the OEM and sometimes the 3rd party. Make some phone calls.
The telling point is that if you call the OEM and they send someone, that person will be from one of those one of those local 3rd party groups.
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I understand he was a very successful photographer, then decided to move into a profession where he could actually make some money!
I see you have met the guy or his brother.
Cheers,
Bernard
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Can't speak as to wide printers as I have a 3800. I ran 1,400 prints - about 94,000 sq. in. through the 3800 before I had to replace the ASF at a cost of $150. Most of these prints were on MOAB Entrada which, being double sided, is tough on the rollers. At times I wouldn't print for several months and have never had a single clog. Not sure you can wear out an Epson printer before you want to upgrade to newer technology.
ASF?
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I'm hoping my 9800 craps out before the two year extension I paid for is up.