Luminous Landscape Forum

Raw & Post Processing, Printing => Printing: Printers, Papers and Inks => Topic started by: seamus finn on February 18, 2008, 07:15:18 am

Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 18, 2008, 07:15:18 am
Is there any outstanding reason for printing through Qimage rather than Lightroom or CS3, both of which I use? I've read the Qimage reviews (all seem very positive) and I've downloaded the latest trial version which I'm working on. It looks a little tricky at first glance. I use a Canon 5D, L glass lenses and an Epson 2400.

Typical of my luck, while doing a few test prints, I ran out of inks and my supplier says he can't get replacements  for a few weeks.   Meantime, I'm stuck re testing (not that I'm any great expert in this field) so I would appreciate any advice from Qimage devotees and others.  Is it a steep learning curve? I don't want to invest a lot of time learning the application if it's not worth the candle in the long run (cost, obviosly, isn't the issue as it seems terrific value).

Should I go for it?

Thanks all
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: rdonson on February 18, 2008, 07:35:37 am
Lightroom doesn't offer softproofing so you print from there blind unless you want to roundtrip to CS3 for softproofing.  That could be a productivity hit depending on your workflow.

Qimage provides uprezzing and final sharpening that's fairly automatic and produces excellent results.  This can be a significant time saver.

Qimage's image placement capabilities are pretty good.

The ability to provide print filters instead of altering your initial image can be very advantageous.

All in all Qimage is an incredible bargain.  Imagine Adobe offering free updates for life for its software.  Ain't gonna happen.  Then there is Mike's incredible responsiveness to bug reports and how quickly he revs the software.  

I expect that Adobe will close the gap to Qimage eventually by offering softproofing and uprezzing and good final sharpening in Lightroom.  When that happens it may satisfy the needs of a number of people.

At this point there isn't much of a contest.  Qimage is designed to make printing easier and better than CS3 or Lightroom.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 18, 2008, 09:58:53 am
Ron,
Thanks very much for that.

Workflow speed for me isn't the  biggest issue - I tend to concentrate on one print at a time (landscapes anyway).

Re the sharpening issue, where does Qimage auto sharpening come in the scheme of things? My approach would have been to apply all the sharpening in CS3 and turn it off in Qimage. Where does the Qimage automatic final sharpening come in the equation?  

On the other hand, in Lightroom, where sharpening is less than adequate, could you apply some sharpening in LR and let the Qimage auto sharpening do the rest at print stage? If the latter is the case, then Qimage sharpening would be a big advantage used in conjunction with Lightroom, wouldn't it, eliminating the need to round-trip into PS for sharpening.

Regards,
Seamus
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on February 18, 2008, 10:14:00 am
Quote
Ron,
Thanks very much for that.

Workflow speed for me isn't the  biggest issue - I tend to concentrate on one print at a time (landscapes anyway).

Re the sharpening issue, where does Qimage auto sharpening come in the scheme of things? My approach would have been to apply all the sharpening in CS3 and turn it off in Qimage. Where does the Qimage automatic final sharpening come in the equation? 

On the other hand, in Lightroom, where sharpening is less than adequate, could you apply some sharpening in LR and let the Qimage auto sharpening do the rest at print stage? If the latter is the case, then Qimage sharpening would be a big advantage used in conjunction with Lightroom, wouldn't it, eliminating the need to round-trip into PS for sharpening.

Regards,
Seamus
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=175659\")

 do all my sharpening in Photoshop where needed but let Qimage do the smart print sharpening. That should be possible with Lightroom too but there's an issue with Exif, Tiff or SDK import from Lightroom in Qimage if I recall some discussions on the Qimage mailing list. Not a Lightroom user so I skipped that topic then. See:
[a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/qimage/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/qimage/[/url]

enlist and go to the archives, a google on Qimage + Lightroom may do it too.

Ernst Dinkla

try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/)
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: rdonson on February 18, 2008, 10:18:35 am
Seamus,

The general workflow in CS3 is to get the image where you like it, creative sharpen, uprez, final sharpen and then print.

With Qimage its simpler.  Get the image where you like it in CS3 or Lightroom save the file and print from Qimage.

If you just labor over one image and then print and don't do this very often perhaps Qimage won't be much of a consideration.

One thing you'll hear from folks is how quirky the Qimage UI is.  Personally, I laugh when I hear that because Photoshop has such a steep and long learning curve.  In reality it takes about an hour to get the basics of Qimage under your belt.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Craig Murphy on February 18, 2008, 11:00:59 am
Isn't Qimage a much better layout program than PS or LR?  I don't see any of that easy capability in either one of them.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: rdonson on February 18, 2008, 04:55:43 pm
Quote
Isn't Qimage a much better layout program than PS or LR?  I don't see any of that easy capability in either one of them.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=175678\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I sure think it is.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: jpgentry on February 18, 2008, 05:46:08 pm
I love Qimage.  It's awesome for laying out prints.  CS3 has the automated layout feature which to me takes about 5 times as long to use.

Additionally I think Qimage is one of the best at sharpening and interpolating for print.  I am always pleasantly surprised to see my prints coming out so much better than prints from CS3.  I personally don't like alot of sharpening on portraits so I turn Qimage sharpening down to 3 when peoples faces are involved.

-Jonathan
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: evonzz on February 19, 2008, 04:43:19 am
I am using Photokit Output sharpening in PS2 before sending prints to my 3800 and find it works very well.  
How  does Qimage sharpening compare with Phtokit for final output?
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 19, 2008, 05:51:54 am
Ron and Ernst,
Thanks guys – very enlightening and a bit of an eye-opener.

After messing around with the latest version of Qimage Pro for a few hours (available as a free trial download for thirty days from the Qimage site)  it’s already obvious that this is a multi-layered, powerful package with lots of useful features. It’s certainly more comprehensive than anything PS or Lightroom has to offer. A careful reading of the PDF tutorial is well worth it because there is much to learn. So far, I've just scratched the surface.

For instance quite by accident, I discovered you can drag  images from Bridge and drop them unopened  straight into the Qimage print window where they can be viewed in landscape or portrait orientation at the click of a mouse. This is among very many handy features. I tried to do the same with Lightroom but failed. Any picture with the designation _edit _  doesn’t show.

The most intriquing aspect for me so far is the sharpening facility in Qimage. Is it the case, Ron/Ernst, that Qimage automatiscally applies an auto ‘smart’ final output sharpening taking into account  the size of the print, how much it has been upsized etc. This is a chore which I have always found to be hit and miss in PS – proper sharpening being one of the most difficult, misunderstood and misapplied techniques of them all.  It’s easy to overdo or underdo, but damned difficult to get  just right.

Now, if Qimage can do this job satisfactorily, well, that opens up a whole  new ballgame for me at least.

If I understand you correctly, this would be the worlflow: get the image the way you want it in PS,  sharpen as normal, save, open in Qimage,, resize your pic, select the auto sharpen and print. Qimage takes over the output sharpening and Bob’s your uncle. If you wish, you can set your own level – there are three, I think: low, medium and high.

The critical element is that output sharpening is being applied at the correct stage – just before printing. Thus, if you have several finished images in a folder, just open it, bring them into the print queue/window in Qimage,  select the print size, apply auto sharpening and print them all without even opening one of them

Evonzz has posed a good question here.
I am using Photokit Output sharpening in PS2 before sending prints to my 3800 and find it works very well. How does Qimage sharpening compare with Phtokit for final output?

I would be amazed if Qimage sharpening is that sophisticated but does it come anywhere near?  If it does, well, that’s a hell of an achievement for such a reasonably priced package. The sharpening issue alone would be enough to make me buy Qimage straight away.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: shewhorn on February 19, 2008, 06:20:16 am
Quote
I expect that Adobe will close the gap to Qimage eventually by offering softproofing and uprezzing and good final sharpening in Lightroom.  When that happens it may satisfy the needs of a number of people.

I think what's more likely to happen is that Adobe would buy QImage rather than them coding something. If that ever does happen I just hope they don't butcher a whole ton of features like they did when the bought Pixmantec and RAW Shooter.

Cheers, Joe
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: rdonson on February 19, 2008, 06:27:45 am
Quote
I would be amazed if Qimage sharpening is that sophisticated but does it come anywhere near?  If it does, well, that’s a hell of an achievement for such a reasonably priced package. The sharpening issue alone would be enough to make me buy Qimage straight away.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=175890\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I've owned and used PhotoKit Sharpener for several years.  Its a great tool and follows Bruce Fraser's sharpening workflow of: capture, creative and final sharpening.

I only use it for creative sharpening these days though.

I use Lightroom instead of ACR for RAW conversion.  The UI is sooooooo much better IMHO.

I do creative sharpening as needed in CS3.

I use Qimage for my output sharpening.  Yes, its that sophisticated and you have the option in the full screen editor portion of Qimage to adjust the sharpening yourself if you want.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 19, 2008, 07:38:16 am
Ron,
For me, you've just sealed the deal - Qimage, here we go!

Thanks everybody
Seamus
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: ThePhotoDude on February 19, 2008, 07:59:14 am
Throw a spanner in the works here (but only a little spanner) ... I have had problems with color consistency with Qimage. Most probably something I am doing wrong but I couldn't get my head around it, my colors appear dull and washed out when I print from Qimage, the same image printed from CS3 and it is perfect.

Now I know this is to do with a color management issue, perhaps my rendering intent or wrong color space being assigned to the print job. But I couldn't figure it out so I ditched it and do all my printing from CS3.

Perhaps I should pick it back up again.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: walter.sk on February 19, 2008, 09:04:42 am
I've been using Qimage for about 9 of the 10 years I've been using Photoshop.Until this year my use of Qimage has been for print layout, and to override some of the driver limitations in my printers, and nothing more.  Because Qimage did this so well, I have not printed from  Photoshop for many years.  But recently, printing to my Z3100, I started using Qimage to uprez my files and apply final sharpening.  I did several tests with CS3 using my old workflow vs Qimage and my new workflow and found on some images, no visible difference at print size (up to 24x36"), and on others, more pleasing results using Qimage.

My old workflow: Capture sharpening with PKSharpen, optimization of the image at native size (including creative sharpening with PKSHarpen), uprezzing to final print size with Bicubic Smoother, Focus Magic to counter the softness of uprezzing, and PKSharpen for output sharpening.  I then shipped the file off to Qimage just for layout and printing.  I was always hesitant to forgo my own output sharpening even though I preferred some of the interpolation techniques available in Qimage.

After reading some of the technical articles of MCHaney (the father of Qimage) on Steve's Digicams, I decided to try using Qimage for the uprezzing and output sharpening, and have been using that ever since.

My new workflow:  Optimization of the file at the native size in CS3, with capture sharpening with Focus Magic, some creative sharpening when needed (usually not) with PKSharpen, noise reduction (if needed) with Noise Ninja (not necessarily in the stated order), softproofing in CS3 using the specific printer/paper profile  and then
letting Qimage uprez the picture using Hybrid interpolation and Q's Smart Sharpening, which I vary between settings of 3 and 5 depending on the level of detail and type of image.  I have not had one print that disappointed me, at least in terms of comparison to my old workflow.

Incidentally, if I tell Qimage what profile the monitor is using, and the correct printer/paper profile, I never have a surprise in terms of color rendition on the print.  However, I do calibrate and profile my CRT monitor every 2 weeks, and use homemade profiles for the printer and paper.

I also have given up being a "pixel-peeper," and judge entirely by the printed results of my work.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on February 19, 2008, 09:18:11 am
Quote
Now, if Qimage can do this job satisfactorily, well, that opens up a whole  new ballgame for me at least.

If I understand you correctly, this would be the worlflow: get the image the way you want it in PS,  sharpen as normal, save, open in Qimage,, resize your pic, select the auto sharpen and print. Qimage takes over the output sharpening and Bob’s your uncle. If you wish, you can set your own level – there are three, I think: low, medium and high.

The critical element is that output sharpening is being applied at the correct stage – just before printing. Thus, if you have several finished images in a folder, just open it, bring them into the print queue/window in Qimage,  select the print size, apply auto sharpening and print them all without even opening one of them

Evonzz has posed a good question here.
I am using Photokit Output sharpening in PS2 before sending prints to my 3800 and find it works very well. How does Qimage sharpening compare with Phtokit for final output?

I would be amazed if Qimage sharpening is that sophisticated but does it come anywhere near?  If it does, well, that’s a hell of an achievement for such a reasonably priced package. The sharpening issue alone would be enough to make me buy Qimage straight away.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=175890\")

Qimage does the entire job in the best way. Upsampling to the best (selectable and adjustable) algorithms around, downsampling with the right (adjustable) anti-aliasing (can slow the process much though on large files), (adjustable: 1-20) smart print sharpening based on several conditions in the process. I will not mention the variety of nesting, size adaption methods and margin creation + cropping on the fly that's possible. The page edit window tells you where that image is on the page and makes adjusting easy. Batch processing. Hot folder. Etc, etc, etc.

All that happens at the final stage before printing. That image file you saved before isn't compromised by the output you want today and will be fit for another job on another media and printer next time. I have a printserver, the files that go in that direction will not return to my main system.

Similar with its color management. With color I have not seen differences with Photoshop output. It uses the LCMS color engine and Mike adapted the less standardised elements that they fit the Photoshop outcome well. Nested images on one print page can get individual printer profiles attached but more practical also individual rendering choices. With B&W and QTR profiling there was an issue but that had probably more to do with the ICC compatibility of the QTR profiles. I'm using a slightly different workflow then.

Sharpening on heavy extrapolated images is a bit tricky and can only be judged on a cropped proof at the output scale. Print sharpening always looks overdone on a display so in my opinion it doesn't help to use a separate print sharpening step and softproof it in PS. Print sharpening samples on the web are for the same reason not sensible. It is rare that I check the sharpening in printed proof as most of the time Qimage does a good job at the 5 default and for larger prints at 2. But you want to be sure that it is good when a 2 meter long print has to be made. There are pictures on the web that compare Qimage sampling and anti-aliasing to other software results. No samples on print sharpening.

It's the equivalent of the Watts Towers in software, also build by one man so who's going to argue that it is a bit hard to find your way in it and doesn't have that slick appeal of Mac or Adobe applications. I think that may also be a reason why it isn't so popular on this website. With an application that loaded with features I still wonder who could do it better. So far M$, Adobe or Apple didn't deliver anything close. The RIP that I have cost me about 50x more and the time I use it is probably 50x less. It is even slower in rasterising of Tiffs.


Ernst Dinkla

try: [a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/[/url]
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Jon Meddings on February 19, 2008, 10:09:46 am
Quote
Qimage does the entire job in the best way. Upsampling to the best (selectable and adjustable) algorithms around, downsampling with the right (adjustable) anti-aliasing (can slow the process much though on large files), (adjustable: 1-20) smart print sharpening based on several conditions in the process. I will not mention the variety of nesting, size adaption methods and margin creation + cropping on the fly that's possible. The page edit window tells you where that image is on the page and makes adjusting easy. Batch processing. Hot folder. Etc, etc, etc.

All that happens at the final stage before printing. That image file you saved before isn't compromised by the output you want today and will be fit for another job on another media and printer next time. I have a printserver, the files that go in that direction will not return to my main system.

Similar with its color management. With color I have not seen differences with Photoshop output. It uses the LCMS color engine and Mike adapted the less standardised elements that they fit the Photoshop outcome well. Nested images on one print page can get individual printer profiles attached but more practical also individual rendering choices. With B&W and QTR profiling there was an issue but that had probably more to do with the ICC compatibility of the QTR profiles. I'm using a slightly different workflow then.

Sharpening on heavy extrapolated images is a bit tricky and can only be judged on a cropped proof at the output scale. Print sharpening always looks overdone on a display so in my opinion it doesn't help to use a separate print sharpening step and softproof it in PS. Print sharpening samples on the web are for the same reason not sensible. It is rare that I check the sharpening in printed proof as most of the time Qimage does a good job at the 5 default and for larger prints at 2. But you want to be sure that it is good when a 2 meter long print has to be made. There are pictures on the web that compare Qimage sampling and anti-aliasing to other software results. No samples on print sharpening.

It's the equivalent of the Watts Towers in software, also build by one man so who's going to argue that it is a bit hard to find your way in it and doesn't have that slick appeal of Mac or Adobe applications. I think that may also be a reason why it isn't so popular on this website. With an application that loaded with features I still wonder who could do it better. So far M$, Adobe or Apple didn't deliver anything close. The RIP that I have cost me about 50x more and the time I use it is probably 50x less. It is even slower in rasterising of Tiffs.
Ernst Dinkla

try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=175914\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Just found this thread. Couldn't agree more as I've said in another forum. Qimage is a superb piece of software and for me takes over completely for PKS output sharpening. It also has the wonderful result of now not having to have entire directories for different size prints of the same image - each uprezzed (and chewing up disk space) and sharpened for that specific size. Now, one final image in native resolution and then print at any size with the appropriate upressing and sharpening done automatically, at the time of the print by Qimage.

When I tested the output of several prints with Qimage on a native resolution file vs upressing and PKS followed by a print I was surprised. I would have accepted a close contest as a win for Qimage as it is an easier workflow. I was very surprised to see that the output of Qimage, while certainly being easier, was also better.

I've also found that assigning qimage.exe to a second editor in LR is useful. Now, with a finished image in my LR catalog I can just right click and 'edit' in qimage and print the file immediately.

In some ways I can imagine it being a great success for Adobe to buy Qimage and substitute this for the print engine in LR - however, as someone else commented I'd hate to lose the special features Qimage has and it is not really that difficulty to use it in conjunction with LR.

My best advice is to run, don't walk, down to DDISoftware and purchase a copy of Qimage.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 19, 2008, 10:21:53 am
Guys,
This is becoming more fascinating and intriguing by the minute. Jon, that's a fantastic idea for Lightroom- apart from the convenience, it also gets around LR's limited sharpening capability and is definitaly a top tip for seamless integration of both programmes.

In the opposite direction, as you are well aware, it's also possible to set your external editor out of Qimage as Lightroom (or PS) so the traffic either way is painless, fast and super efficient.

In fact, the more contributions come in here, the more Qimage looks like a jewel in the crown. I've already downloaded the trial version - now I'm going to buy a registration number based on the unqualified praise here.  

Thanks again all.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: neil snape on February 19, 2008, 10:48:54 am
I love it. I suggested HP buy the company and build Qimage into the drivers. They didn't so you still have to use a PC, and fortunately you can still use it with most any printer.

It is simply great.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 19, 2008, 10:58:37 am
Update:

Just got my hands on some ink and set to work on Qimage. Only two or three sessions in, it already seems to be everything you guys have claimed - and then some. The 'smart' /auto sharpening/uprezzing facility is very impressive - apart from anything else, as pointed out above, it means you don't have to make separate files for different output print sizes etc. Just open the file and let Qimage do the heavy lifting.

Also, used in conjuction with Lightroom, it's a very good workaround to deal with LR's output sharpening failings up to now, although that may change when LR2 arrives. There are many other powerful utilties as well. For the price, this programme is amazing value, with a guarantee of lifetime free upgrades.

My only regret is that I didn't start using it sooner - had seen it mentioned here and elsewhere over a long period, but baulked at the notion of having to learn yet another application.

A bad mistake.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: JeffKohn on February 19, 2008, 07:14:27 pm
I must be in the minority, I don't care for QImage's sharpening at all as it seems to be too halo-prone for my tastes. I do like using it for print layout and management of driver settings, but for larger prints I still do my own upsizing and sharpening.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Quentin on February 19, 2008, 07:22:40 pm
I used to use ImagePrint.  I've now returned to using Qimage because, to be honest, its a better program at a fraction of the cost, now that manufacturers' own OEM printer drivers are better than they used to be.

Quentin
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: SeanPuckett on February 19, 2008, 07:39:17 pm
QImage puts money in my pocket, because I save a lot of time using it vs. any other conceivably affordable output mechanism.  The output quality is excellent (and this is what matters).  The layout and UI is clunky even when one is familiar with it, and there are some things one will never get used to.  Still, when a customer can come in and say "hey, I want another 32x40 print, and a couple 16x20s also" and I spend more time loading canvas than dealing with layout, uprezzing, sharpening etc etc etc ... it's proved its worth.  A no brainer purchase, I'd buy it again in a heartbeat.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: NikoJorj on February 20, 2008, 05:43:52 am
Quote
The layout and UI is clunky even when one is familiar with it, and there are some things one will never get used to.  Still, [...]
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=176066\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
I feel... a bit reassured by what you say : I just began to try it, and reading the manual produced actually more interrogations than answers    ...
Still digging, though : this software really looks like a gem hidden in the dirt.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: chilehead on February 20, 2008, 09:05:43 am
All good comments, and I agree with the positives and negatives mentioned.  My only addition for Seamus is to include the Qimage folder in your backup scheme.

It would be a shame to lose all those layouts and settings!

Mark
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 20, 2008, 10:42:20 am
Yes, the UI is a bit clunky and the PDF tutorial is hard to digest - but the rewards seem to be worth the hassle.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 20, 2008, 10:50:19 am
Good tip, Mark, easy to overlook - thanks for that.

Seamus
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: dealy663 on February 21, 2008, 11:41:35 pm
I also have been unable to see the benefit that QImage has over PS for uprezzing and sharpening.

Now The most I've ever really tried is taking an image from a D200 and going up to 24x36", so maybe that has something to do with it.

But I've tried on multiple occasions to see where QImage was doing a better job at sharpening than either PK sharpener or my own by hand use of PS's smart sharpen. The same goes for the many uprezzing algos in QImage. I was just unable to produce something noticeably better with QImage.

I wonder what I'm missing that others are seeing? Maybe I'm really good at my sharpening and uprezzing in PS, or maybe I'm so blind that I can't see what everyone else sees? I dunno.

Derek

Quote
I must be in the minority, I don't care for QImage's sharpening at all as it seems to be too halo-prone for my tastes. I do like using it for print layout and management of driver settings, but for larger prints I still do my own upsizing and sharpening.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=176055\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: DarkPenguin on February 21, 2008, 11:45:09 pm
I think part of it is that if it does as good a job it makes your life easier.  You don't need to make multiple versions for different size prints.  Just stop short of output sharpening and save that.  Then let qimage do the rest for each print size.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: seamus finn on February 22, 2008, 05:08:51 am
One of the big revelations for me is how Qimage works so easily in tandem with Lightroom. Learning Qimage for just a few days now, I seem to have effortlessly slipped into this routine: import pics into LR; apply adjustments in Develop Mode as normal; sent images to Qimage via alternative external editor and print from there, allowing Qimage to apply the final smart sharpening. No need to worry about print sizes and individual sharpening etc. It's fast, easy and painless, as Dark Penquin points out above - and it opens up the whole array of Qimage print facilities at the click of a mouse.

For those of us not happy with LR sharpening (and nobody is) this workflow is one way to go until LR gets its sharpening act together. Also, if you don't use  or like LR, you can drag images from Bridge  (in CS3 anyway) straight into the Qimage print windows so long as they are not RAW.This way, you edit a bunch of pics in Photoshop, save them to a folder as usual without final sharpening, open the folder in Bridge and drag them into Qimage for final auto sharpening and printing.

Just some intitial impressions from a Qimage beginner. Some practical tips from seasoned veterans would be good.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Treve willis on March 19, 2008, 11:21:32 am
Quote
Is there any outstanding reason for printing through Qimage rather than Lightroom or CS3, both of which I use? I've read the Qimage reviews (all seem very positive) and I've downloaded the latest trial version which I'm working on. It looks a little tricky at first glance. I use a Canon 5D, L glass lenses and an Epson 2400.

Typical of my luck, while doing a few test prints, I ran out of inks and my supplier says he can't get replacements  for a few weeks.   Meantime, I'm stuck re testing (not that I'm any great expert in this field) so I would appreciate any advice from Qimage devotees and others.  Is it a steep learning curve? I don't want to invest a lot of time learning the application if it's not worth the candle in the long run (cost, obviosly, isn't the issue as it seems terrific value).

Should I go for it?

Thanks all
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=175633\")

Hi

I have been using Qimage for 2½ years and Lightroom for about 3
months. I have done some comparisons with using Qimage and the
Lightroom print module and written them up.

If anyone is interested in my comparison, it can be found @
[a href=\"http://churchillphotographer.blogspot.com/2008/03/comparing-image-printing-through.html]http://churchillphotographer.blogspot.com/...ng-through.html[/url]

Regards
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Ray on March 19, 2008, 12:22:05 pm
I\ve been using Qimage ever since Photoshop misbehaved with my Epson 7600. I rang Epson about the problem and they referred me to Adobe. Anticipating complications, I simply switched to Qimage, a program which I'd been considering using for some time, and I've never looked back.

I'm also mightily impressed when you are guaranteed a lifteime of support and upgrades for one initial purchase price. I just hope Adobe does not buy out this company as they did with RSP.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Paul Sumi on March 19, 2008, 12:50:50 pm
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I'm also mightily impressed when you are guaranteed a lifteime of support and upgrades for one initial purchase price. I just hope Adobe does not buy out this company as they did with RSP.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182743\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

A few years ago Mike Chaney (author of QImage) related a story about Microsoft expressing interest in him and his company. It's said that everyone has his price, but evidently Microsoft couldn't find Mike's.

Unless things have changed dramatically, I doubt that Adobe will find Mike's price, either.

Paul
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Nill Toulme on March 19, 2008, 01:14:03 pm
One of the most common remarks you see about Qimage is "I only wish I'd tried it sooner."  I've certainly said that more than a few times myself.

Nill
~~
www.toulme.net
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: jpgentry on March 19, 2008, 03:19:27 pm
Slower?  Yes.  Because it's doing what takes three steps in Photoshop in just one step.  They are:
1. Resizing (Interpolating)
2. Sharpening
3. Printing

You are probably not comparing apples to apples when it comes to the time taken to do these steps.

-Jonathan

Quote
I downloaded a trial copy and tried it on a 12x18 photo that I upsampled from 8x12 in Qimage and using the default sharpening. The results were excellent but it seemed much slower than printing through ps CS3. 

Sharon
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182762\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: rdonson on March 19, 2008, 03:38:15 pm
A nice write up, Treve.  You forgot to mention there is one thing Qimage can do that Lightroom cannot.

Softproof.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Hellstan on March 19, 2008, 05:31:19 pm
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Lightroom doesn't offer softproofing so you print from there blind unless you want to roundtrip to CS3 for softproofing.  That could be a productivity hit depending on your workflow.

Qimage provides uprezzing and final sharpening that's fairly automatic and produces excellent results.  This can be a significant time saver.

Qimage's image placement capabilities are pretty good.

The ability to provide print filters instead of altering your initial image can be very advantageous.

All in all Qimage is an incredible bargain.  Imagine Adobe offering free updates for life for its software.  Ain't gonna happen.  Then there is Mike's incredible responsiveness to bug reports and how quickly he revs the software. 

I expect that Adobe will close the gap to Qimage eventually by offering softproofing and uprezzing and good final sharpening in Lightroom.  When that happens it may satisfy the needs of a number of people.

At this point there isn't much of a contest.  Qimage is designed to make printing easier and better than CS3 or Lightroom.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=175634\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Alas, no Quimage for Mac…
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on March 19, 2008, 07:39:16 pm
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Alas, no Quimage for Mac…
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182805\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Easy solution: Just get a PC (and learn how to really suffer).  
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Scott Martin on March 19, 2008, 09:58:46 pm
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Alas, no Quimage for Mac…[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=182805\")
ImageNest for the Mac is worth looking into. [a href=\"http://www.bluecubit.com/]http://www.bluecubit.com/[/url]
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Hellstan on March 19, 2008, 10:19:09 pm
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Easy solution: Just get a PC (and learn how to really suffer). 
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182821\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Never ever give à $ to Ballmer the Enbalmer and Mr Gate$.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Hellstan on March 19, 2008, 10:19:50 pm
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ImageNest for the Mac is worth looking into. http://www.bluecubit.com/ (http://www.bluecubit.com/)
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182845\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That's a reasonable sensible reply to my Mac.
 
Comes to a price though.  
Tried to toggle a bit : I think I will have to read the manual…  
Lightroom does the trick too.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Paul Sumi on March 20, 2008, 12:27:05 am
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Also, if you don't use  or like LR, you can drag images from Bridge  (in CS3 anyway) straight into the Qimage print windows so long as they are not RAW.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=176614\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Actually, the Studio version can read a number of RAW formats directly (I just tried it with my 1Ds2).  However, it's pretty pokey when you try to soft proof, display a RAW file or try to adjust curves, etc.

OTOH, QImage Studio  seems to process a RAW file for printing just about as fast as a full rez TIFF.  Might be handy for contact sheets or quick proofs.

Paul
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Greg Lockrey on March 20, 2008, 03:50:00 am
A couple of things I can say about Qimage. I do custom fine art printing for a living but occasionally I am asked to make 30 foot banners for charitable organizations like the MS Society that need something for bike events that they put on to raise cash. Often all I have to work with is a letter head logo that needs to be made into a 30 ft banner. Now we aren't looking for high end quality signage, but something economical. Qimage has always done a great job in interpolation. I once had to make a 10x12 foot display from a 8x10" 300 dpi original. The graphic artist who designed the display came in from Chicago (to Toledo, OH) to see it run, he was shocked that such a display was possible with such a small file. I am currently testing Lightroom on my Mac, but setting up layouts is way easier with Qimage. I have my Mac fitted with Parallels so that I can run the Qimage too.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: chris moody on March 20, 2008, 05:37:52 am
I have read this thread and was surprised to find no mention of one of Qimages most impressive and useful features and that is it's ability to queue many images on many pages as well as fit images of different sizes together in a way that saves paper and minimises cutting.

I have searched high and low and have found no other program that can do this or even come close. I have recommended it to many photographers.

For the mac users out there, I would suggest getting a cheapo PC (or revive an old one that can meet the specs required) and use is as a stand alone print server running Qimage. Use it with a shared folder on the mac and it works like a charm.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Hellstan on March 20, 2008, 05:46:15 am
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I have read this thread and was surprised to find no mention of one of Qimages most impressive and useful features and that is it's ability to queue many images on many pages as well as fit images of different sizes together in a way that saves paper and minimises cutting.

I have searched high and low and have found no other program that can do this or even come close. I have recommended it to many photographers.

For the mac users out there, I would suggest getting a cheapo PC (or revive an old one that can meet the specs required) and use is as a stand alone print server running Qimage. Use it with a shared folder on the mac and it works like a charm.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182905\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Why not ImageNest, as suggested before ?
I hate the idea of having a PC, or Parallels+Windows in my Mac.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: chris moody on March 20, 2008, 05:52:17 am
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Why not ImageNest, as suggested before ?
I hate the idea of having a PC, or Parallels+Windows in my Mac.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182906\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hmm, never heard of that, will take a look. Thank you.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: NikoJorj on March 20, 2008, 07:19:02 am
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I have read this thread and was surprised to find no mention of one of Qimages most impressive and useful features and that is it's ability to queue many images on many pages as well as fit images of different sizes together in a way that saves paper and minimises cutting.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182905\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Yes but...
When I tried to use this feature, Qimage didn't show nor took into account the printer margins (3-4mm on every side with my R1800). The result, when I wanted to print 2 A5 on a A4 sheet, was that the margins were uneven around the images once cut in the middle of the paper.

At least as far as I know about Qimage (not that far I confess), LR behaves much better on this particular problem : set margins to Xmm, cell spacing to 2Xmm, and everything is centered on the paper.
With Qimage, when I try to do that, the images are centered on the display, but adding the printer borders, it's off - I'd need to have a greater border between the prints, and didn't find how to do that automatically.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Jonathan Wienke on March 20, 2008, 07:28:12 am
QImage does allow you to set up any desired border around prints. You can also set your own custom top/bottom/left/right page border spacing. Go through the manual and carefully look at the section for setting up custom layouts. Also keep in mind that most printers' paper feed mechanisms have a few mm of side-to-side inconsistency, and if you're trying to print right up to the edge of the paper you're not always going to be perfectly centered.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: chris moody on March 20, 2008, 07:58:05 am
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Why not ImageNest, as suggested before ?
I hate the idea of having a PC, or Parallels+Windows in my Mac.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182906\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I downloaded and tried the trial version (printing disabled) and it appears to be a simple queueing program for the mac. Simple and effective....pricey for what it is though....and a strange pricing structure....the bigger the machine (owners of which are more likely to use such a program) the higher the price.

I am certainly interested but will wait and see how it develops...it seems to be very new on the market.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Hellstan on March 20, 2008, 07:59:44 am
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I downloaded and tried the trial version (printing disabled) and it appears to be a simple queueing program for the mac. Simple and effective....pricey for what it is though....and a strange pricing structure....the bigger the machine (owners of which are more likely to use such a program) the higher the price.

I am certainly interested but will wait and see how it develops...it seems to be very new on the market.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=182929\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes, in that range, price is outrageous : 280 euros for my 24" Z3100.
Oups…
I might stick to LR multiple print ability for now.
Cheers
Hellstan
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: hassiman on March 20, 2008, 01:08:18 pm
I am setting up to run Qimage on my Mac in VM Fusion.  I chose Fusion as it can be almost totally isolated from the host (Mac) OS in case Win XP gets contaminated.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: jpgentry on March 23, 2008, 02:07:33 am
I want to be able to export from Lightroom to Qimage but I'm getting errors on Vista and XP when I set up Qimage as my secondary editor in Lightroom.

Anyone else having this issue?
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: Ernst Dinkla on March 23, 2008, 04:58:35 pm
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I want to be able to export from Lightroom to Qimage but I'm getting errors on Vista and XP when I set up Qimage as my secondary editor in Lightroom.

Anyone else having this issue?
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=183662\")


There have been some threads on the Lightroom>Qimage workflow on the Qimage mailing list. There are solutions for the problems. I have no Lightroom so didn't follow the threads in detail.

[a href=\"http://groups.yahoo.com/group/qimage/]http://groups.yahoo.com/group/qimage/[/url]


Ernst Dinkla

Try: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Wide_Inkjet_Printers/)
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: jpegman on March 23, 2008, 11:28:33 pm
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I want to be able to export from Lightroom to Qimage but I'm getting errors on Vista and XP when I set up Qimage as my secondary editor in Lightroom.

Anyone else having this issue?
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=183662\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I'm using WinXP and Lightroom 1.4 and just browsed for my Qimage.exe file, set my preferences to export as TIF's and no problems at all.

When I export one or more images, Qimage automatically opens up with all my selected images in the thumbnail browser and I'm off and running. It really works great - totally seamless, and as a secondary editor, I can still directly export to Photoshop CS3 if I need to do pixel level editing.

If you are a member of NAPP (National Association of Photoshop Professionals), email them the problem and they will rapidly reply. If you do not belong to NAPP, email the problem to Adobe direct, and give then a day or two to reply.
Title: Qimage v the rest
Post by: jpgentry on March 24, 2008, 01:49:24 am
The issue was that I have to have Qimage open in the background and things work fine.  If I let LR invoke Qimage without it opened it will crash Qimage as it tries to open in the background.

That said I'm using Vista 64 so...