Luminous Landscape Forum

Equipment & Techniques => Medium Format / Film / Digital Backs – and Large Sensor Photography => Topic started by: JonTMiller2 on November 07, 2007, 04:47:41 pm

Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JonTMiller2 on November 07, 2007, 04:47:41 pm
After a comment that the image I posted had purple blobs, I decided to text my ZD back with a printed 16x20 target made up of graduated monochrome steps.  Using a ZD back on an RZ IID, 110mm lens, 1/400 f32 with strobe lighting, iso 50, I shot the target.

This is the same setup that I used for several pieces of artwork.  I discovered two things.  Any purple blob issue was obscure.  But, I had dead pixels showing as dark spots larger than one pixel.  I called Mamiya on Thursday.  They requested that I send them the back for replacement.  The replacement arrived today.

Just shot the test target again which is attached.  Sorry, it is a jpg and not very exciting but revealing.  Close up you will see blemishes.  THEY ARE IN THE PRINT.

I am very pleased with the response from Mamiya.  I am also in love with the back on my RZ (and AFD).  The RZ setup in the studio is great.

I did not test the ZD at higher ISOs.  I was shooting at f32 as it was.

I started shooting weddings with an RB67.  When I wanted no noise, I used pan-X pushed to ASA 100.  When speed, Tri-x  and lived with the noise as part of the process.

Thank you, Mamiya!
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: EricWHiss on November 07, 2007, 04:56:11 pm
hmmm....I hope that's jpeg artifacts that I'm seeing because otherwise that sure looks like a noisy file for ISO 50 at least to me.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JonTMiller2 on November 07, 2007, 05:43:34 pm
The target was printed on watercolor paper.  Uncompressed, the image has texture similar to the paper.  In order to post, I had to set the jpg quality to 5.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: mcfoto on November 07, 2007, 05:51:27 pm
Hi
Enjoy your ZD back & its good to hear how good the service is from the MAC group.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 07, 2007, 06:04:00 pm
Is this your new shot or the older back..
In the second to outer black/grey line there is purple blobbing all over?
How can you miss this?
does anyone else see it? I see Purple blobbing all over the second to darkets part.. Or is that Jpeg artifacting???
Hope it is the jpeging?
Does anybody else see the purple blotches?
Thanks for the Post
Snook
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: david o on November 07, 2007, 06:24:46 pm
Snook,
I see at the border of the darker gray but as it follows perfectly the square I think it must be due to jpg. Not random at all.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JonTMiller2 on November 07, 2007, 06:37:08 pm
Quote
Is this your new shot or the older back..
In the second to outer black/grey line there is purple blobbing all over?
How can you miss this?
does anyone else see it? I see Purple blobbing all over the second to darkets part.. Or is that Jpeg artifacting???
Hope it is the jpeging?
Does anybody else see the purple blotches?
Thanks for the Post
Snook
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151173\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

IN acr, I took samples all over the image.  I get uniform readings.  I do not see any blobs on my calibrated 1920x1200 display.  Even whe I zoom at 400% on the posted image, I do not see.
???
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JonTMiller2 on November 07, 2007, 06:42:50 pm
Quote
Snook,
I see at the border of the darker gray but as it follows perfectly the square I think it must be due to jpg. Not random at all.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151179\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I saw the same issue on my display (before jpg).  When I took color samples in the region you noticed, I got uniform rgb readings across the area of difference.  I think it is a display technology issue???
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: mcfoto on November 07, 2007, 06:54:12 pm
Quote
IN acr, I took samples all over the image.  I get uniform readings.  I do not see any blobs on my calibrated 1920x1200 display.  Even whe I zoom at 400% on the posted image, I do not see.
???
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151183\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Hi
Then don't worry about it as you don't have it. For people interested in the ZD they should test it themselves  on a test shoot.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: samuel_js on November 07, 2007, 07:10:10 pm
Quote
Is this your new shot or the older back..
In the second to outer black/grey line there is purple blobbing all over?
How can you miss this?
does anyone else see it? I see Purple blobbing all over the second to darkets part.. Or is that Jpeg artifacting???
Hope it is the jpeging?
Does anybody else see the purple blotches?
Thanks for the Post
Snook
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151173\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Yes, I see that too. I can hardly believe that's jpg compression.  
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: david o on November 07, 2007, 07:31:26 pm
Quote
Yes, I see that too. I can hardly believe that's jpg compression. 
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151195\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I don't know what it is but it's definitely not worms. And the center rectangle is clean. I can zoom in and you can see how the image is dirty due to compression...
I think a good quality crop would help.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Anders_HK on November 07, 2007, 09:02:56 pm
Quote
Is this your new shot or the older back..
In the second to outer black/grey line there is purple blobbing all over?
How can you miss this?
does anyone else see it? I see Purple blobbing all over the second to darkets part.. Or is that Jpeg artifacting???
Hope it is the jpeging?
Does anybody else see the purple blotches?
Thanks for the Post
Snook
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151173\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Jon (JonTMiller2),

That does not appear like the purple blobbing syndrom (as Frank Doorhof had). It looks like same artifacts as I have with my ZD camera (although I will see better on my display at night when less reflections on display). Actually your test is very similar to mine. To add, a user of an earlier series ZD camera reported that he did not have that issue in same test as mine.

I am very interested to know the first two letters on the serial number on your ZD back. Will be in Hong Kong on business Friday thru Monday, and will speak to my agent there on this, thus very much appreciate if you can inform me of your serial's first letters. Please email me private if you like.

Has anyone else experienced similar on a Leaf or Phase or other back or even DSLR???

Much kind thanks.

Regards
Anders
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 07, 2007, 10:08:11 pm
Jon, I do not think it is a monitor problem as I checked in my studio today and saw the same thing.
It is the same as we saw from some who posted a shot of a Diner cafe type joint and it was all over the white back wall as well on his ZD and just about every ZD I have seen, so far.
I do not know if it is Jpeg or whatever but how odd it shows up on every ZD picture.
Frank had posted a picture of a model well back lit and the same Blotchy purple "stuff" was going on in his picture.
Whether you call worms or whatever there is definetly some purple blotchy "stuff" in these ZD pictures and every one I have seen.
I am not trying to knock the ZD , I am just stating an obvious observation that I can clearly see on most ZD pictures posted.
Could be a monitor problem on your side, maybe your blacks are so black with contrast you might not noticed it? But my monitors are calibrated often and I see it quite clearly.
Maybe some can post the RAW of the same file and see if it is a Jpeg problem.
In any case thanks for the information and post..:+}
Snook
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: mcfoto on November 08, 2007, 03:33:34 am
Hi
We tried putting the file into photo shop, it is so small it is the size ( image ) of a postage stamp. So we looked at it as shown on LL on a Quato monitor. We could not see purple blobbing at all. The outer square seems to have a purple cast all the way around. When the next inner square starts it is grey. It could be the paper or the way the light is hitting it.....etc. But in the end the image  is so small it is hard to judge. To me there are no purple blobs because they do fall into the next square. Go out and take pictures with the back. Also if you are using a Mac try a demo of Raw Developer so you can compare it to Photo Shop raw.
Thanks Denis
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: thsinar on November 08, 2007, 03:44:10 am
Denis,

I think you did like me: you have downloaded the 4 kb "thumbnail of this image!

Download in the Menu ---> Save as and then it has the right size (22x17", 240 dpi, 61,2 MB's)

Thierry

Quote
Hi
We tried putting the file into photo shop, it is so small it is the size ( image ) of a postage stamp. So we looked at it as shown on LL on a Quato monitor. We could not see purple blobbing at all. The outer square seems to have a purple cast all the way around. When the next inner square starts it is grey. It could be the paper or the way the light is hitting it.....etc. But in the end the image  is so small it is hard to judge. To me there are no purple blobs because they do fall into the next square. Go out and take pictures with the back. Also if you are using a Mac try a demo of Raw Developer so you can compare it to Photo Shop raw.
Thanks Denis
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151246\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 08, 2007, 08:33:14 am
Can this be posted at a smaller rez but higher jpg setting? The jpg artifacting is so bad it's hard to tell what's going on. Maybe also do a full rez crop of a sliver of the bands.

And Snook - I'm starting to think when you hear the letters ZD you see blobs everywhere. Have you actually tested a new generation ZD back or are you just judging the back by what you've seen in this forum?
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JonTMiller2 on November 08, 2007, 08:37:26 am
Crop of test image, saved jpg level 12.
Also, crop of lower right, DC color checker.
As requested by several.
Remember, some of the noise is from watercolor paper.
DC color checker is smoother.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 08, 2007, 08:41:51 am
You could be right...:+}
But as posted by others I am not the only one to see the purpling...:+]
Also I would love for the ZD to pan out as I have a lot of Mamiya equipment and would love to see Mamiya Continue.
Why is it that these artifacts seem to be showing up on the ZD only?
No I have never even seen a ZD so cannot comment personally..:+}
Just going by what people are posting in forums and so far EVERY ZD post has some kind of purple artifacting going on!
Whether it is the Blobs,worms whatever you want to call it.. It is there!
Either that or my eyes have gone bad??
Whether you guys like it or not there is some purple cr@p going on there...
And it seems to be in every ZD post that. I have never seen it on any other camera MF or 35mm DSLR.
The closest thing I have seen to it is when some whites get blown out in some sky shot's on my 1DsMII and 5D. But not in the Blacks!!
Don't you think I would love to have a Half way decent MFDB for 7,000$... you bet you, But not until it proves to 100% useable.
What would I tell my client after shooting a days worth of pictures and there are Purple patches all over the Place??
Snook
PS. I hope as well as many others that it is just some kind of Compression problem posting here on the web...
These second test strips look better, But I would love to see the original Test card form the first posted image here in RAW or with out so much compression?
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 08, 2007, 09:24:05 am
Quote
Don't you think I would love to have a Half way decent MFDB for 7,000$... you bet you, But not until it proves to 100% useable.
Problem is that you seem to only want to believe the ZD back is shit. I've been very honest in my postings about the back. The first back I had was bad - purple blobs, noise and lockups. The back that Mamiya replaced it with works perfectly. I've posted images from the new back in this forum.

Bottom line - GO TEST A BACK YOURSELF.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 08, 2007, 09:26:27 am
Quote
Remember, some of the noise is from watercolor paper.
DC color checker is smoother.
The color checker looks fine. Enjoy your back.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 08, 2007, 10:04:21 am
Hey Bob I thought you were shooting with an Aptus or Some kind of leaf? Are you shooting with both leaf and ZD?
Just wondering as I have seen many threads of yours. And was wondering why you would be shooting the ZD if you have a Lwaf system and Leaf is surely better than the ZD.
By the way like your shot's a lot.. very nice.
I have been offered a pretty great deal on an Aptus 22 or 65 and have been deciding between Leaf 22 and a P30.
AS i have stated I CAN NOT GO TEST ONE!!!
Actually going to New York next week and am trying to get some time to test out both the Aptus 22 and P30? Just by chance I got a gig to New York..
Thanks for any more information.
Snook
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Henry Goh on November 08, 2007, 10:06:20 am
Spend your time shooting with your back rather than doing tests for others.  If they have flawed eyesight, that's their own problem, not yours.

Enjoy your gear.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 08, 2007, 10:47:31 am
Snook

I'm now shooting with the ZD only. I did own a Valeo 22 but it's long gone.

IMO the Aptus 22 is NOT a better deal unless you can find one for under 10k.

I just posted a ton of test images from the ZD in my mini review thread.

One more thing - since you'll be in NYC next week why not make a phone call to test a ZD back as well?
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 08, 2007, 11:05:47 am
That actually is a good idea.. You have any contacts in New York?
I see B&H never has any in Stock. And not sure who reps Mamiya in New York..
I would appreciate and Information.
The Aptus I am Looking at is around that price.. A little more but to where I live which is a pain in the Butt...:+]
I have seen a couple of Aptus 22's but it is difficult to find in AFDII format and they are usually used from Non-dealers so not sure about warranty and the state of the actual back? You know what I mean.
The price I am getting is with a Dealer for Leaf and it is refurbished with one year warranty.
I often wonder about the ZD because I would like to have a back, that supposedly has the same chip as the Aptus for 7,000$. That is a no brainer. But the Screen plus continuos shooting speed at 1.2 FPS Until you want, Unlike the ZD is worth the Extra $$ in my find. Not to mention the Aptus tethers "better" Supposedly..
I am not knocking the ZD, Only making an observation on what I see. And I have good eye sight:+}
I did not want to comment on your studio shot, because I respect your opinion and it sounds like a lot of people are getting irritated with my post,mostly ZD owners logically, But I am not trying to BASH for the heck of it.. I have better things to do with my time , believe me!
But maybe some of the Purple stuff could me some mix of Moire also.
In your studio shot close up crop of the Black shirt.. There is something going on there but looks more like a moire problem.. Maybe?
Look at it real quick and there is some purple stuff on the shirt.
I appreciate your post and information a lot, so do not take my comments so personally, because they are in no means meant to offend anybody..
After all, in the end it is just a Picture...:+}
I just get paid pretty good for my work and always want to provide 100% to my clients and do not want to play the sending back game to get a good back no matter what Brand it is.
A lot of people in here are in the states or where they can try, send back, whatever they want to decide on a back,
I cannot, so I am in a different boat.
Thanks
Snook
PS. Nice shot's on your web, I like your pronounce style.. Very Unique..
 
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: John Schweikert on November 08, 2007, 11:34:19 am
Snook,

Not sure why you have found it difficult to find Aptus 22's in the Mamiya mount. In the last 4-8 weeks, they have been abound. Mpex.com has had 8-10 of these as cast off from one of the large photo schools. They are brand new, mine started with 0 shot count. They just have to sell them as demo status so that Leaf promotions (reduced extended warranty, free AFDII bodies with purchase) are not eligible for those purchases. They had one that just ended a few days ago that didn't sell. Call them up and get a "new" unit for a great price.

Here is the best little free app for the Mac that lets you keep track of any search you want to create for ebay auctions: http://www.iwascoding.com/GarageBuy (http://www.iwascoding.com/GarageBuy)

I have about 50-60 saved searches in this app and never go to ebay unless I need to. Saves a huge amount of time and you get constant updates. You have to be clever with search strings to get variations of how people post items for sale, but I have seen many digital backs on ebay for months in the AFD mount, Aptus 22, the highest.

I still agree that you should test for your style of shooting and user experience, but if you were originally interested in the ZD back and now looking for an Aptus, they are out there with no strings attached.

I commend Bob for posting some simple samples of his recent ZD back, because it does show that the file quality is there. Basically what I am seeing from my Aptus. The huge difference between the two backs comes down to speed, the screen and tethering.

LC11 for Leaf tethers flawlessly to my Macbook. Lightroom makes beautiful conversions of the Aptus files and the back itself on my AFD (non II) works with no errors or hiccups. I have 6 batteries, found a cheap source online for good L-ions and some faster CF cards.

I like easy to use items. I don't like to jump through hoops to use gear.

Caveat to the warranty for my back, it has a full one Leaf warranty which Leaf America would handle with very quick turnaround of a few days. But because of where I purchased the back, I can't expect 24/7 tech support as Steve Hendrix provides to his clients. But at the same time, I consider myself skilled enough at all the tech side, it shouldn't be too difficult to solve issues barring major service repairs.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 08, 2007, 11:45:20 am
Thanks Jon...:+}
I have been and actually before I posted today checked Mpex but they do not have any Aptus 22's on their site? Maybe they are just throwing them on e-bay.
I did see some one win one for 10,000, A while back, but I was not so sure on Aptus 100% to jump the gun... And it did go for 10,000..:+}
Saw another guy but private individual who sold is aptus 22 and a WHOLE lot of gear for 16,000 but I e-mailed him and he said it had no warranty on the back so that through me off...
Thanks for you info.. I do think the aptus is worth a couple of k$ more for it's features.
But have no hands on experience...
You actually influenced me towards Leaf with some of your post as I was battling between it and the P30 which I know is  a great camera back also.
Does the bulky battery position bother you at all? And Do you have have a special plate for tripods so that is does not touch the tripod below....? Like the old plate for the polaroid back for mamiya. I had one of those also...
Thanks for any further info..
Have any recent shot's of your Aptus 22? I think you shoot mainly products if I remember correctly?
Snook
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 08, 2007, 11:52:54 am
Snook,

Call Calumet about a ZD back. I spoke to them 2 months ago and they were planning to carry them.

Also, why not just pick up the phone and call MPEX about the Aptus 22? They had one on ebay just a few days ago for a buyit now price of $10.5k.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: John Schweikert on November 08, 2007, 12:38:10 pm
Snook,

Bob's right, be aggressive by calling them up. Don't rely on what is shown on their website. Talk to Stu at Mpex.com, he's the 'man' to work with.

The battery is not an issue when mounted to the tripod. I use two different tripods, ball head and standard three way head, all Bogen/Manfrotto with the hex plates. I use a flat hex plate (type you need a coin to screw in) which helps in having a flat botton for laying the camera down and with that the battery is almost flush when on a table.

When tethered, the Aptus runs off the computer's power via firewire. On my Macbook, works great. I just plug in the laptop every so often during the day to get the charge back up if doing location work.

I find I can get close to two hours on a standard SB-L160 type battery. I also bought the Impact dual bay recharger from B&H to get more batteries charged at once. The single charger from Leaf just won't cut it when you have a bunch of batteries.

When looking for batteries for the Aptus, search with 'Samsung SB-L160' or the larger capacity versions of SB-L320 and SB-L480.

I love Capture One having used it for four years now with my Canons, but I just didn't 'connect' with their digital backs. The screens of the non plus backs were not good for judging an image at all. The Leaf screen is good not great. It does give a respectable view of the image. Zooming shows 100%. The touch screen works quite well with a finger or the stylus. The custom scroll button on the side is great, set from factory for scrolling through shots and seeing the info/histogram with your thumb on your grip hand. Makes for very easy use. The screen is completely unviewable in daylight. But I use A Hoodman screen loupe for my Canons and it works great for the Aptus outside. Like looking at a slide on a light table.

If you want to see some full res Tiffs, I already have some on my FTP that I was showing a friend. Email me and I will send you the links to them. I just don't want to post full res client work here.

I know the 33mp and 39mp backs are much more resolution, but the Aptus 22 has just beautiful files. Plenty of detail. Usable ISO from 25-200, I still need to experiment with what 400 can do.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: wilburdl on November 08, 2007, 02:38:48 pm
Quote
Bob's right, be aggressive by calling them up. Don't rely on what is shown on their website. Talk to Stu at Mpex.com, he's the 'man' to work with.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151333\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Yeah, they forget about that site sometimes. I actually brought my 1DsII and lenses from Stu. Only 2 hours away  
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Snook on November 08, 2007, 02:59:50 pm
Thanks A lot John...
My e-mail is:
ekphotography@mac.com
I would appreciate it if I could check one out...
I'll throw it away right after examining it.
You have any with people?
That would great. I am going to Call Midex right now and see if they have anything..:+}
Thanks again
Snook
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Anders_HK on November 09, 2007, 05:59:45 am
Quote
Crop of test image, saved jpg level 12.
Also, crop of lower right, DC color checker.
As requested by several.
Remember, some of the noise is from watercolor paper.
DC color checker is smoother.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151281\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Jon,

I maintain what I see on your test samples posted seem identical to the problem with my ZD camera. I also see it on these last posts, also in the darker tones on the color checker. Yet by now my eyes are trained on detecting this. It is not the same purple blobs that Frank Doorhof encountered. I do not know if related. In actual shooting it does not usually show up, but it does so on limited number of my photos. It is difficult to say in what situation. It definently does not show up on most samples posted in these forums from the ZD back or camera. That is wrong. Indeed I have some images I am very pleased with from my ZD also   .

Currently I am on visit to Hong Kong and am just back from my agent here. My ZD camera is now going back to Mamiya in Japan for investigation. I am told Mamiya WILL work on this problem to solve and rectify (estimate within one month or shorter).

I can only praise my agent here in their service in handling this case. Currently I have another ZD camera on loan, but their helpfullness extends beyond that. Perhaps when buying this level of equipment that is something to consider as compared from buying from a store or mail order house that does not give service as an agent does and nor has same familiarity with the product. Or can you expect same from Canon or Nikon as a Mamiya agent???

I do like Mamiya. My Mamiya 7II is lovely. I got 6 slide films back from processing yesterday, mostly Fuji Velvia 50. Wow! Awesome. Velvia 50 colors nirvana . Played with the AFDII + ZD back when at agent. Viewfinder is crisper and brighter than ZD camera and it accepts filmback. Of course I also like the ZD camera... neither is perfect, both very good . Looking forward to them solving this problem, meanwhile... I guess still some happy shooting   .

Regards
Anders
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 09, 2007, 09:28:02 am
Anders,

It's good to hear you're getting the issue resolved. When I had issues with my first ZD back I simply  emailed Mamiya and they got the ball rolling. I have an open dialogue running with a Mamiya tech and Mamiya replaced my ZD back with no questions asked. Email and phone calls have always been answered promptly and Mamiya service rocks IMO.

I've never had the same experience with Nikon or Canon. I have a friend fairly high up in CPS that  I can call on if needed and Canon has hooked me up with loaner gear on occasion but I've never heard of Canon offering to replace a defective camera right off the bat. NPS, in my experience, is a joke. Terrible service, gear sent back broken or sent back months later with a CYA attitude all the way. With that said, I recently spoke to a few Nikon reps and they said NPS had some sort of a shakeup recently and the service is much better.

Anyway - please let us know what happens with your camera.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: Anders_HK on November 10, 2007, 04:42:32 am
Quote
Anders,

It's good to hear you're getting the issue resolved. When I had issues with my first ZD back I simply  emailed Mamiya and they got the ball rolling. I have an open dialogue running with a Mamiya tech and Mamiya replaced my ZD back with no questions asked. Email and phone calls have always been answered promptly and Mamiya service rocks IMO.

I've never had the same experience with Nikon or Canon. I have a friend fairly high up in CPS that  I can call on if needed and Canon has hooked me up with loaner gear on occasion but I've never heard of Canon offering to replace a defective camera right off the bat. NPS, in my experience, is a joke. Terrible service, gear sent back broken or sent back months later with a CYA attitude all the way. With that said, I recently spoke to a few Nikon reps and they said NPS had some sort of a shakeup recently and the service is much better.

Anyway - please let us know what happens with your camera.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=151495\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Bob,

Will post the outcome when I get it .

Regards
Anders
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 14, 2007, 12:50:53 pm
All,

After reading through most of these threads regarding the performance of the ZD back, I've decided to accept the apparently obligatory photo criticism to share some shots using my AFD and ZD so that others can look into the quality of the image reproduction of the ZD Back.

I'm curious if those of you familiar to these files or these backs see the same issues or concern in my files as you've seen in others.  I bought my back in August when they first appeared in the US market and have slowly become accustomed to its behavior, strengths and weaknesses.  

I've had a few issues with the back locking up and some potential purple fringing, but my call to MAC group in NY and conversation with tech support yielded the response that "if the AFD goes to sleep, sometimes the back and the camera miscommunicate and you'll need to reset the AFD and ZD back by opening the battery door," and "the color cast you may see could be a result of not getting the exposure right and therefore the sensor not processing the image correctly."  

While I am open to these two issues being the case, I hope that this community might be able to view my files in order to help me discover whether my ZD back is operating as expected.

Thanks,

Josh

(I'm hoping the file comes through ok, if not, I'll repost)[attachment=3840:attachment]
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 14, 2007, 01:10:29 pm
Let's try again on posting a larger image...
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: rainer_v on November 14, 2007, 01:58:20 pm
Quote
Let's try again on posting a larger image...
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152766\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
you should post your jpeg with less compression, its not a problem if they have some mb more. if not its pretty worthless to see an image in the quality you provide them here. lots of banding and very strange artefacts in the grass,- which are not made by the back.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 14, 2007, 03:31:24 pm
Quote
you should post your jpeg with less compression, its not a problem if they have some mb more. if not its pretty worthless to see an image in the quality you provide them here. lots of banding and very strange artefacts in the grass,- which are not made by the back.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152773\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Rainer -

Thanks, I noticed the same.  The jpg compression doesn't allow folks to view these at the same quality.  Does anyone have recommendation for a workflow/compression scale so that it allow us to accurately post images (at least close enough) while at the same time not clogging the internet?  I tried to post a larger file and it timed out.  


I will try again this afternoon when I'm not posted via my mobile.

-Josh
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: John Schweikert on November 14, 2007, 03:41:23 pm
Josh,

Do you have a website that you can upload files to? That is what I do. I upload to the back end of my site/ftp and then just post the full URL to that image using the http tag above the reply box.

If you are worried about bandwidth, then just post a 100% portions instead directly using the IMG tag with your uploaded image URL.

Quote
Rainer -

Thanks, I noticed the same.  The jpg compression doesn't allow folks to view these at the same quality.  Does anyone have recommendation for a workflow/compression scale so that it allow us to accurately post images (at least close enough) while at the same time not clogging the internet?  I tried to post a larger file and it timed out. 
I will try again this afternoon when I'm not posted via my mobile.

-Josh
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=152801\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 14, 2007, 04:23:32 pm
You might want to also make some full rez crops with the areas of concern and post those.

If you're seeing a purple fringe along the edge of your image or any strange noise in the shadows at ISO 200 you have a bad back and Mamiya will replace it.

The older backs had a little note in the box talking about some sort of reset procedure that sounds like what the person at Mamiya told you. The newer backs with the hardware/ firmware fix do not have the note in the box.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: espressogeek on November 14, 2007, 05:47:39 pm
I would like to see the full rez copies of these too. I was going to buy a back from BH today but they sold out before I got the chance. Once again I watch the site.....
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 14, 2007, 05:59:07 pm
I have my ZD back for sale as I've decided to go back to shooting Canon DSLR's.

Check the for sale section.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 16, 2007, 03:16:13 am
Quote
Josh,

Do you have a website that you can upload files to? That is what I do. I upload to the back end of my site/ftp and then just post the full URL to that image using the http tag above the reply box.

If you are worried about bandwidth, then just post a 100% portions instead directly using the IMG tag with your uploaded image URL.
[{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a] (http://index.php?act=findpost&pid=152803\")

Thanks John,

This seems to work.  

I'd love for folks to look through the files for image review (color rendition, peering the extremes for purple worms/blobs, etc) in order to dig into the quality of my ZD Back.  My serial number is GDXXXX, which is one of the earlier backs (Bob, it came with the "warning/fix" sticker) so I'm worried it has old firmware/hardware.  My call to Mamiya Tech Support yielded little support.  They said the occasional "locking" and error messages on the ZD Back were within normal limits, so right now they don't see the need for me sending it in for "fixing."  As a result I want to make sure the files are clean and the back is doing its job correctly.

FYI, these are mostly snaps shots and a couple of lightly composed shots, not my art shots, so criticism on artistic qualities not needed...

Thanks,

Josh

[a href=\"http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20071111-MMFC0009-Edit/20071111-MMFC0009-Edit.jpg?disposition=download]Test Shot 1[/url]
Test Shot 2 (http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20071112-MMFC0020/20071112-MMFC0020.jpg?disposition=download)
Test Shot 3 (http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20070915-MMFC0123/20070915-MMFC0123.jpg?disposition=download)
Test Shot 4 (http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20070915-MMFC0076/20070915-MMFC0076.jpg?disposition=download)
Test Shot 5 (http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20070915-MMFC0098/20070915-MMFC0098.jpg?disposition=download)
Test Shot 6 (http://www.joshbrankmanphotography.com/Josh_Brankman_Photography_files/Media/20070915-MMFC0122/20070915-MMFC0122.jpg?disposition=download)
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: EricWHiss on November 16, 2007, 03:29:42 am
Hey Josh,
Just curious....Is that first shot taken in Briones park? Landscape looked familiar to me.

Not sure about your back, probably is fine, but these links can't be full size images so hard to check noise, etc without full size or 100% crops.

Eric
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 16, 2007, 04:02:31 am
Quote
Hey Josh,
Just curious....Is that first shot taken in Briones park? Landscape looked familiar to me.

Not sure about your back, probably is fine, but these links can't be full size images so hard to check noise, etc without full size or 100% crops.

Eric
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=153266\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Eric,

Not sure where Briones Park is.  Those shots were in Sonoma County, just outside of Glen Ellen.

Uploaded full rez shots.  Should be up and working.  

-Josh
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: bcroslin on November 16, 2007, 09:08:49 am
The shots you linked to look great. I'm not seeing any issues. The image of the produce stand really shows what the ZD back can do.

The image of the baseball stadium shows some noise in the shadows that I didn't see in the other images. It looks like jpg artifacting but I can't tell for sure. Is there a way to get me the raw file of that image?

As for the lockups - it could be your camera. Are you using an AFD or AFD II? Mamiya had me ship my 645AFD to them to check it to make sure the lockups weren't a camera issue.

Your back looks fine IMO.
Title: ZD Back Test
Post by: JDBFreeheel on November 16, 2007, 10:04:08 am
Quote
As for the lockups - it could be your camera. Are you using an AFD or AFD II? Mamiya had me ship my 645AFD to them to check it to make sure the lockups weren't a camera issue.
[a href=\"index.php?act=findpost&pid=153308\"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Bob, I am using an AFD and I wonder too if that is the problem. It's an old camera now...

I was going to purchase a AFDII and relegate the AFD to backup duty, but now I might wait for whatever this "new" system that Mamiya and Phase One are putting together.  I can wait and if it indeed allows for older AF Mamiya glass to be used in conjunction with the standard Mamiya back (film and digital), I'll jump aboard.

Thanks for digging into the shots.

-Josh