Luminous Landscape Forum

The Art of Photography => The Coffee Corner => Topic started by: Cornfield on January 21, 2018, 06:24:56 pm

Title: US Government shutdown
Post by: Cornfield on January 21, 2018, 06:24:56 pm
Is the US Government shutdown likely to affect a planned trip to Yosemite and Death Valley in early February?
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: sdwilsonsct on January 21, 2018, 06:48:45 pm
Canada will be open.  ;)
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 21, 2018, 07:32:11 pm
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/at-the-nations-parks-the-confusing-reality-of-the-government-shutdowns-first-day/2018/01/20/5d5927d2-fe08-11e7-8f66-2df0b94bb98a_story.html?utm_term=.476875350645

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2018/01/20/national-parks-open-or-closed-in-shutdown-its-hit-or-miss.html

Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: HSakols on January 21, 2018, 08:14:09 pm
Here is at least what is happening in Yosemite.  The entrances are open but the National Park Service is closed. Thus, many important projects and services are no longer operating.  Aeromark, the concesioner, will remain open and offer services.  This shut down is different from the one in 2013 when the park was closed to visitors. These shutdown really hurt our small rural gateway communities.  Many of us are now concerned the our National Parks are losing their natural protection. For example, visitors can now drive through the park, yet all the public restrooms are closed. I hope some resolution is found soon! 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Two23 on January 21, 2018, 08:14:37 pm
No.  Parks remain open.  All of this stuff is just theater anyway--doesn't mean anything.  The media tries to make it sound like a big deal, (like they did Y2K.)  Yawn.


Kent in SD
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: HSakols on January 21, 2018, 08:16:22 pm
I'm sorry, but it is a Big deal - Dude. 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: tom b on January 21, 2018, 08:46:06 pm
Meanwhile in Australia the second oldest national park in the world remains closed. (http://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/news/sydneys-royal-national-park-to-remain-closed-as-bushfire-tears-through-600-hectares/news-story/33f1d66bacba34f86147c665eec56f18) Arsonists you've got to hate them.

Grrr,
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Two23 on January 21, 2018, 10:07:55 pm
I'm sorry, but it is a Big deal - Dude.


LOL.  Nothing happens.  Nothing ever happens.  It's all theater.  They should be afraid we figure out that nothing happens when things are "shut down", which means nothing much happens when it's not. ;D :D


Kent in SD
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: DP on January 21, 2018, 10:12:13 pm
Arsonists you've got to hate them.

https://cosmosmagazine.com/biology/australian-raptors-start-fires-to-flush-out-prey
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: tom b on January 21, 2018, 11:06:33 pm
https://cosmosmagazine.com/biology/australian-raptors-start-fires-to-flush-out-prey

Ooooh, you learn something new every day! Better than listening to politicians.  :)

Cheers

Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 21, 2018, 11:26:54 pm
... visitors can now drive through the park, yet all the public restrooms are closed...

We don't need no stinking (pun intended) public restrooms! It is called "call of nature" for a reason :D
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Rob C on January 22, 2018, 04:22:40 am
We don't need no stinking (pun intended) public restrooms! It is called "call of nature" for a reason :D

Exactly!

Who ever saw a bear use a public toilet! Nature knows best; it's what streams are for, and why they always flow away from you; of course, it takes really developed woodsmanship to know whch side is up... that's why I fear forests: subliminally, I have seldom known which side was up - ask my toast.

Speaking of which, have you noticed that however careful you might be, when you take the marmalade jar out of the fridge, it always feels sticky? I also notice that cling wrap film has lost much of the original clinginess that made it famous. Sometimes, if the tomato or lemon is too big for my purposes, I put half of it onto a little saucer, open face down, and wrap it in said film in order to kept it fresh for next time; it takes forever to seal that simple combination of challenges. It can't be me: it has to be the film. Proof lies in the obvious: was a time that only women could handle it successfully and rapidly, but now anybody can use it and feel confident that not only won't it cling to itself (a once major condition for use of much film), but it won't work as a air excluder at all because it just flops rather than sticks. Perhaps I should rtfm: could be one needs to soak it before use, just like red beans.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: HSakols on January 22, 2018, 08:24:58 am
Not that many here really care, but my concern is that the new administration wants to do away with any type of resource protection and they would like to eventually privatize our national parks.  If there are no bathrooms people throw toliet paper everywhere - but again many landscape photographers here could give a flying fuck about the preservation of our National treasures.  Sad.  I understand that for the majority of you this shutdown does not affect you, but I live on land owned by the government.  Many residents in my town don't know when they are getting there next pay check.  These are not the 1%. 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Klein on January 22, 2018, 08:52:29 am
Exactly!

Who ever saw a bear use a public toilet! Nature knows best; it's what streams are for, and why they always flow away from you; of course, it takes really developed woodsmanship to know whch side is up... that's why I fear forests: subliminally, I have seldom known which side was up - ask my toast.

Speaking of which, have you noticed that however careful you might be, when you take the marmalade jar out of the fridge, it always feels sticky? I also notice that cling wrap film has lost much of the original clinginess that made it famous. Sometimes, if the tomato or lemon is too big for my purposes, I put half of it onto a little saucer, open face down, and wrap it in said film in order to kept it fresh for next time; it takes forever to seal that simple combination of challenges. It can't be me: it has to be the film. Proof lies in the obvious: was a time that only women could handle it successfully and rapidly, but now anybody can use it and feel confident that not only won't it cling to itself (a once major condition for use of much film), but it won't work as a air excluder at all because it just flops rather than sticks. Perhaps I should rtfm: could be one needs to soak it before use, just like red beans.
Try Glad Press 'N Seal.  Works much better.  That cling wrap plastic never worked very good.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Klein on January 22, 2018, 08:57:35 am
We'll find out in a few hours when they vote again whether this thing will drag on.  There was a time when the Federal government could have shut down for a year and nobody would notice. 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Otto Phocus on January 22, 2018, 09:23:21 am

LOL.  Nothing happens.  Nothing ever happens.  It's all theater.  They should be afraid we figure out that nothing happens when things are "shut down", which means nothing much happens when it's not. ;D :D


Kent in SD

Tell that to the people who are not getting paid, but still have to work.  It is most likely that the government workers will get their back pay, but for contractors and FFRDCs, they are operating at risk.

It may not be a big deal to you, but that does not mean it is not a big deal for others.

A lot of the smaller companies simply don't have the ability to float during these shutdowns.  I am fortunate in that the company I work for has a 14 day float.  After that, it is leave without pay or you can take vacation, if you have it after the holidays.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Two23 on January 22, 2018, 09:52:33 am
Not that many here really care, but my concern is that the new administration wants to do away with any type of resource protection and they would like to eventually privatize our national parks.  If there are no bathrooms people throw toliet paper everywhere -

I do care.  I think the vast majority of people in my state care, and probably region for that matter.   I don't think any of that will happen.  The media seems to be nothing but a fount of negativity and deception.  It has turned into Pravda.   I just turn it off.



Kent in SD
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Robert Roaldi on January 22, 2018, 11:37:30 am
No.  Parks remain open.  All of this stuff is just theater anyway--doesn't mean anything.  The media tries to make it sound like a big deal, (like they did Y2K.)  Yawn.


Kent in SD


Y2K was a big deal. It's not because nothing major went wrong that there weren't problems that needed fixing.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 12:01:03 pm
Well, I'll tell you, a government "shutdown" is just awful. We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc. And you guys are worried about parks?

What incredible horse-hockey. A "government shutdown" is a Kabuki performance presented in Washington DC. In the long run the only people affected are the politicians who caused the "shutdown." Last time it was Republicans. This time it's Democrats. Dumb move, Chuckie and Nance. Even CNN is on your case.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Rob C on January 22, 2018, 12:08:07 pm
Well, I'll tell you, a government "shutdown" is just awful. We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc. And you guys are worried about parks?

What incredible horse-hockey. A "government shutdown" is a Kabuki performance presented in Washington DC. In the long run the only people affected are the politicians who caused the "shutdown." Last time it was Republicans. This time it's Democrats. Dumb move, Chuckie and Nance. Even CNN is on your case.

If it pans out that way, the Turks will happy and the Kurds not so much. Israel may sweat for a day or two, though. Syria itself, however, just stirs in its basket.

;-)

Rob
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 12:11:37 pm
...The media seems to be nothing but a fount of negativity and deception.  It has turned into Pravda...

Indeed. How the times have changed. Russians used to say that there is no truth in Pravda (Russian for "truth"), nor news in Izvestiya (Russian for "news"). Americans today have fake news. American media today have turned into a propaganda arm of the coup attempts.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 12:11:52 pm
Well, I'll tell you, a government "shutdown" is just awful. We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc. And you guys are worried about parks?

What incredible horse-hockey. A "government shutdown" is a Kabuki performance presented in Washington DC. In the long run the only people affected are the politicians who caused the "shutdown." Last time it was Republicans.

Is it? Or is it a matter of perspective, like with photography ...
Moderate Republican senators urge firmer pledge on immigration from McConnell
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shutdown-republicans/moderate-republican-senators-urge-firmer-pledge-on-immigration-from-mcconnell-idUSKBN1FB24L

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 12:16:12 pm
Believe me, Bart, it's NOTHING like photography.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Rob C on January 22, 2018, 12:18:24 pm
Believe me, Bart, it's NOTHING like photography.

Are you sure, Russ; have you considered Billy Eggleston?

;-)
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 12:20:49 pm
Well, I'd have to think about that one for a while.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Klein on January 22, 2018, 12:30:25 pm
This is all about the mid-term elections.  None of these officials cares a whit about "dreamers", shutdown, etc, just what effect it will have on gaining or keeping power.  We really need term limits.  It will stop stupid things like this, make officials more responsive to doing what's right, increase government efficiency, and reduce waste.  These people should go home and find real jobs.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: MattBurt on January 22, 2018, 12:32:28 pm
We'll find out in a few hours when they vote again whether this thing will drag on.  There was a time when the Federal government could have shut down for a year and nobody would notice.

Was that when America was great?
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Klein on January 22, 2018, 01:02:20 pm
Democrats dropped their opposition and will vote to re-open the government.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/01/22/mcconnell-offers-olive-branch-re-open-government-but-enough/1053324001/
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 01:56:33 pm
Kabuki performance over. To be rerun in February.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on January 22, 2018, 05:20:18 pm
Kabuki performance over. To be rerun in February.
And probably an exact rerun of this performance.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Cornfield on January 22, 2018, 06:15:00 pm
Thanks for all the replies to my post.  Good to hear the concern about access to the parks has been resolved and my forty year wish to visit Yosemite can be fulfilled providing world war three does not start within the next few weeks :>)

Someone more famous than me once said "two countries separated by a common language".  This keeps coming to mind when I (in the UK) try to understand some of the crazy reports we get from the US on a host of issues, especially politics. 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 06:22:12 pm
Well, US politics is wild, but good heavens, Corn, look around you.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Goldhammer on January 22, 2018, 06:24:55 pm
Well, I'll tell you, a government "shutdown" is just awful. We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc. And you guys are worried about parks?

What incredible horse-hockey. A "government shutdown" is a Kabuki performance presented in Washington DC. In the long run the only people affected are the politicians who caused the "shutdown." Last time it was Republicans. This time it's Democrats. Dumb move, Chuckie and Nance. Even CNN is on your case.
Russ,

You are totally ignorant about the shutdown and what services will be shut down.  Military, FAA and other critical operations continue just as they did in previous shutdowns.  The more important point that you are overlooking is that this vote was for a budget that was supposed to have begun on October 1, 2017 (e.g., last year) when the government fiscal year begins.  The Republicans were in charge of the entire authorization and appropriations process since January 20, 2017 and they could not even do the simplest of tasks, pass a budget by the beginning of the new fiscal year.  This is wholly on the Republicans!! 
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 06:42:19 pm
Russ,

You are totally ignorant...

That's a personal attack, Alan! As a moderator, you should ban yourself immediately ;)

But if that is permissible, then I'll turn the table: you are totally ignorant of the figure of speech known as tongue-in-cheek or sarcasm ;)
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 07:44:53 pm
That's a personal attack, Alan! As a moderator, you should ban yourself immediately ;)

Smiley aside, which in this case is a cop out and not a joke, Alan is not a moderator of this thread!!!!

In fact, the post seems to be more to the point than some of the other apologetic Republican biased posts. And BTW, tongue in cheek has nothing to do with it, and you know it.

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 22, 2018, 07:58:29 pm
Russ,

You are totally ignorant about the shutdown and what services will be shut down.  Military, FAA and other critical operations continue just as they did in previous shutdowns.  The more important point that you are overlooking is that this vote was for a budget that was supposed to have begun on October 1, 2017 (e.g., last year) when the government fiscal year begins.  The Republicans were in charge of the entire authorization and appropriations process since January 20, 2017 and they could not even do the simplest of tasks, pass a budget by the beginning of the new fiscal year.  This is wholly on the Republicans!!

You're kidding, right, Alan? If not, you really need to do some serious research. You think I'm "totally ignorant? Wow! Go look in a mirror my friend. You also want to check on your sense of humor and see where it went. You don't seem to be able to recognize sarcasm.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: digitaldog on January 22, 2018, 08:02:22 pm
Wow, the back and forth about who's ignorant and that we've got a moderator in all this only illustrates why Chris and Kevin should consider just shutting down the Coffee Corner forum entirely. Nothing to do with photography or image editing, printing etc. What is the justification for such a forum now and moderators?

Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 08:04:22 pm
... Alan is not a moderator of this thread!!!!

See the attachment.

Quote
... And BTW, tongue in cheek has nothing to do with it, and you know it.

Really!? Are you seriously suggesting that Russ, a fighter pilot, thought that "We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc."?! Seriously!?

Some people seems to have their funny bone surgically removed at birth.



Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 08:07:16 pm
... just shutting down the Coffee Corner forum entirely. Nothing to do with photography or image editing, printing etc. What is the justification for such a forum now and moderators?

As you often advise others, if you do not like it, do not visit it (Coffee Corner).
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 08:18:26 pm
See the attachment.

Really!? Are you seriously suggesting that Russ, a fighter pilot, thought that "We have to withdraw our troops from the field, ground all aircraft since the FAA can't operate, bring all our ships into port, etc., etc., etc."?! Seriously!?

I'll let Russ respond to that ...

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 08:24:55 pm
See the attachment.

This is too stupid to dignify with a full response (consider yourself lucky). You disappoint me Slobodan, really, you do.

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: BobShaw on January 22, 2018, 08:25:15 pm
The media tries to make it sound like a big deal, (like they did Y2K.)  Yawn.
Y2K was a big deal to those that had to fix it. Unfortunately because they did fix it the public thinks nothing happened.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 08:28:41 pm
Y2K was a big deal to those that had to fix it. Unfortunately because they did fix it the public thinks nothing happened.

Indeed, and I (amongst many) was part of avoiding the potential catastrophes, and we did ...

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 08:33:33 pm
Indeed, and I (amongst many) was part of avoiding the potential catastrophes, and we did ...

Guess who is responsible for creating the Y2K problem in the first place? The same masters of the universe who now claim they are certain what the future brings 50 years from now.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: digitaldog on January 22, 2018, 09:03:08 pm
As you often advise others, if you do not like it, do not visit it (Coffee Corner).
Good advise. It's a stain of a forum in an otherwise set of excellent forums. Hence I wonder why Kevin and Chris, even with moderators volunteering (and oddly) keep it open. Go at it boys; you can all discuss who's got a bigger button.  8)
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 09:08:38 pm
Guess who is responsible for creating the Y2K problem in the first place? The same masters of the universe who now claim they are certain what the future brings 50 years from now.

You suggest to be incapable of learning from past experiences, unless you really are (most likely) trolling (again, without smileys), most others are not ...

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Rand47 on January 22, 2018, 09:12:05 pm
“Every time I think I am a Republican, they do something greedy, and every time I think I am a Democrat, they go and do someting stupid.” - Jay Leno

This forum merely recapitulates the polarization and lack of civility that is destroying the US. 

Rand
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 09:12:24 pm
Good advise. It's a stain of a forum in an otherwise set of excellent forums. Hence I wonder why Kevin and Chris, even with moderators volunteering (and oddly) keep it open. Go at it boys; you can all discuss who's got a bigger button.  8)

The moderators of the forum allow the participants to make fools of themselves, or not ...

Seems fair enough...

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 09:13:49 pm
“Every time I think I am a Republican, they do something greedy, and every time I think I am a Democrat, they go and do someting stupid.” - Jay Leno

This forum merely recapitulates the polarization and lack of civility that is destroying the US

+1

cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: digitaldog on January 22, 2018, 09:14:13 pm
The moderators of the forum allow the participants to make fools of themselves, or not ...
In not just this one forum and in forums without moderators volunteering. And not just on this site unfortunately.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Bart_van_der_Wolf on January 22, 2018, 09:19:44 pm
In not just this one forum and in forums without moderators volunteering. And not just on this site unfortunately.

While I agree in general, this particular forum allows participants to lower (or increase!) the esteem they really deserve ...

Cheers,
Bart
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Slobodan Blagojevic on January 22, 2018, 09:32:35 pm
...lack of civility...

Guess where that lack of civility is coming from? Who is calling others in this debate "ignorant, stupid, and fools"?
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Eric Myrvaagnes on January 23, 2018, 12:14:19 am
Here's my suggestion for LuLa:

How about a new section called "Politics," which is constructed in such a way that anything posted to it disappears 5 seconds after being posted.   ;D
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: RSL on January 23, 2018, 07:05:52 am
I'll let Russ respond to that ...

Cheers,
Bart

There's really nothing to say, Bart. Alan just demonstrated once again that he has serious problems with comprehension.
Title: Re: US Government shutdown
Post by: Alan Goldhammer on January 23, 2018, 08:36:09 am
There's really nothing to say, Bart. Alan just demonstrated once again that he has serious problems with comprehension.
Sorry for the initial poor chose in adjectives about Russ and for that I apologize.  The main point remains, the Republicans totally did not do the main job of governing which is to pass an operating budget in time for the current fiscal year.  President Trump proposed a budget almost a year ago and the Republican controlled Congress had ample time to go through the authorization and appropriations processes (which is mainly routine work done by Congressional staff).  They did not, preferring to spend time on repealing the Affordable Care Act and tax reform (which was not really a reform bill since it was not budget neutral and will continue to add to the US federal deficit).  Congressman Ryan (who should really have known better given his history with the Budget as well as the ways and Means committees) and Senator McConnell did not keep their eyes on the ball and messed this up big time.  Of course they were not helped by President Trump who seems to have no clue at all about how Congress works.  For a good summary of this, see Catherine Rampell's column in today's Washington Post:  https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/blame-mcconnell-and-ryan-for-the-shutdown/2018/01/22/d352ebec-ffb8-11e7-bb03-722769454f82_story.html?utm_term=.be6b04f1295f